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New Poll - Good and Evil
This week's poll is from icassop. No explanation necessary

You can submit poll ideas here (and try to keep them manga/anime-related)
http://www.mangaupdates.com/showtopic.php?tid=3903

Previous Poll Results:
Question: Would you rather
Choices:
Read a crappy manga - votes: 1327 (22.5%)
Watch a crappy anime - votes: 624 (10.6%)
Read a crappy comic book / graphic novel - votes: 84 (1.4%)
Listen to a crappy audio drama / cd - votes: 117 (2%)
Read a crappy novel / book - votes: 245 (4.2%)
Watch a crappy TV show - votes: 481 (8.2%)
Watch a crappy movie - votes: 1037 (17.6%)
Listen to a crappy music album - votes: 197 (3.3%)
Play a crappy video game - votes: 691 (11.7%)
Play a crappy board game - votes: 593 (10.1%)
Play a crappy visual novel - votes: 233 (4%)
Watch a crappy play / musical / performance - votes: 263 (4.5%)
There were 5892 total votes.
The poll ended: October 15th 2016

Maybe I should've said "finish crappy manga" instead. Reading 1 chapter of a crappy manga is nothing
Posted by lambchopsil on 
October 15th 1:34am
Comments ( 23 )  
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Comments (limited to first 100 replies)

» Senrosj on October 15th, 2016, 2:13am

I'm not quite sure which I prefer more. A hero seeing that not everything is as pure as he thought it was, or a villain learning to forgive or love again. The villain turning good seems good for a fluffy manga/novel, but it may be too cheese. The hero turning evil looks good for psychological manga/novels, but it could have too much unnecessary drama.

I guess to me it depends on what I want to read in that moment, so not voting this time.

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» soraking on October 15th, 2016, 2:14am

villain turning good , since its harder to do biggrin

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» MinatoAce on October 15th, 2016, 3:27am

Hero turning evil.

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» KaoriNite on October 15th, 2016, 4:32am

I feel like the villain turning good is predictable in a lot of cases. It's more exciting to see a hero turn evil because it's more unexpected.

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» Trimutius on October 15th, 2016, 5:23am

If to be more precise i prefer hero turning to dark side, but remaining good, and doing good stuff together with demon lord or someone like that.... So i suppose villain turning good is closer to this kind of plot.

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» residentgrigo on October 15th, 2016, 6:24am

Hero turning evil is the safe choice but it works, as pure long form villain stories already barely exist and the ones who do weren´t proper villains, most of the time.
Here is a story about the Joker "Going Sane" after Batman goes missing:
User Posted Image
It could have been better, but the idea is iconic and he is currently a mere butcher:
User Posted Image
Even Suicide Squad had a short dream of him and Harley living a normal life, with children. If the most iconic comic valiant ever can be explored like that, than anyone can. So get to it authors! Mark Waid lastly once wrote the sisters series Irredeemable (a "Superman" went evil) and Incorruptible (evil "Luke Cage" goes good). Irredeemable´s first year is a must but both went on far too long and both kind of stories are a dime and dozen in the US.

Griffith´s lastly fits the 2nd trope but he is neither the protagonist, nor introduced as a hero, nor a proper hero to begin with. Guts is also an anto-hero. See the problem? Some just can´t fit criteria.

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» drunkguy on October 15th, 2016, 7:14am

For manga in general, good turning evil is more interesting. Corruption tends to be more permanent and even if they repent, their evil actions will have lasting consequences.

For american superhero comic books, I would say villain turning good. They've done good going bad so much that it lost all impact, especially since it never lasts.

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» rainbowstreakedskies on October 15th, 2016, 7:23am

This week's polls have results that are nearly 50/50, that's amazing.

Both have their attractions, but a hero that decides to stop protecting the weak and acting for himself only would be fun to see.(Is there any series with that plot? TELL ME IF THERE IS.)

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» Gayrell on October 15th, 2016, 8:55am

It's honestly hard to say since I love both tropes when they're done well, but if I was to choose, I'm a sucker for villains turning good, even if done poorly, whereas a poorly done hero turning evil is just depressing and tends to be super grimdark for no reason other than edge. Villain turning good lets me maintain my fantasy that most people are redeemable and usually gives us the classic "previously terrible person tries to make friends" trope. Also, Zuko from Avatar is one of my favorite character arcs of all time.

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» Nekore on October 15th, 2016, 9:01am

As a lover of anti-heros I go with hero turn evil.

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» svines85 on October 15th, 2016, 9:46am

Iiihhh..........this sounds like it'd mostly be a shounen kind of thing >_<

Well, whatever, a villain turning good........ that's character growth, the other way, yeah, not so much (from my point of view at least).

For the most part, I don't read many stories that are being blatantly told from the bad-guy's point of view or that are obviously meant to glorify / glamorize that element. So, yeah, my "hero" all-out turning "evil".......well, that's most likely going to be the end of the story for me biggrin

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» 4dhi_Caesar on October 15th, 2016, 1:44pm

Lol. No Grey Area eh confused

I chose Villain turning Good cuz it's mainstream and our heroes needs more what ppl(me included) called "the power of nakama" laugh

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» mysstris on October 15th, 2016, 1:58pm

antiheros are interesting.

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» scorpiowolf on October 15th, 2016, 7:44pm

since villains tend to be more interesting then heroes in general I go with the heel/face flip meself, cause usually the best villains had, in Joker's words, that "one bad day" where the world and everybody in it seemed to just sh*t on their lives, ambitions, hopes, & dreams and they just broke and in their minds the only way to heal was to spread the pain around a little or excise the cause of their pain. the journey back to their humanity is compelling to me. on the other hand if done right it can be pretty damned interesting to see heroes "fall" Captain Atom becoming the Monarch, Hal Jordan becoming Parallax, the Justice Lords of the DCAU come to mind.

still all said I'm kind of a sucker for villains in name only, the kind that plot world domination when in costume but help little old lady cross the street in their civvies, lol.

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» RoxFlowz on October 15th, 2016, 11:42pm

Depends. Does the hero turn into an antihero? Or does he turn into a scumbag? Big difference there.

Both tropes are good, went with the villain this time.

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» Suxinn on October 16th, 2016, 2:54am

Echoing what others have said, if it's done well, either can work.

But I chose the "villain turning good" in the end. I personally vastly prefer a well executed redemption narrative (especially if adequate focus is put on the consequences of their previous actions) over a revenge/corruption one. The former, I feel, is harder to do well, while the latter is harder to screw up.

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» WarriorKalia on October 17th, 2016, 9:14pm

Quote from Suxinn
Echoing what others have said, if it's done well, either can work.

But I chose the "villain turning good" in the end. I personally vastly prefer a well executed redemption narrative (especially if adequate focus is put on the consequences of their previous actions) over a revenge/corruption ...


Agreed, actually. I voted the other way around, based on what I like writing... then again, my heroes rarely go 'bad', they mostly just quit. I do love a good redemption storyline though, I'll give you that.

However, I don't quite agree with the latter point. I feel that a corruption narrative's interest generation depends on how heavily it relies on things like "magic" or influence or whatever excuse they have at the time. I have to say I genuinely haven't seen much of Hero going Bad done in a logical way, where everything leading up to that point was a natural consequence of something else, leading to the hero not just giving up, but becoming a villain themselves.

That being said, the few methods I can think of utilizing that trope are hard to pull off well... Hm... Might be why so many of them are not used so much.

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» calstine on October 16th, 2016, 7:47am

I don't like either, actually, but I find the hero turning evil a bit more believable... Not to mention that it creates interesting chances to explore the many ways in which someone may come to betray their own ideals due to desperation/misguided notions/coercion/brainwashing/lust, etc.

I particularly hate it when the villain/ess falls in love with the hero/ine and becomes good, because I loathe the nonsensical "falling in love/having sex with the MC automatically redeems you of all evil" rationale. Even worse when the villain is part of an "evil" or "inhuman" species and is treated like a human (while the rest of their kind is killed/tormented) because they fell in love with a human dead no I do understand the mindset behind it (it's the same reason, for example, that dogs are loved and cats are (mostly) hated: because the former species favours humans and the latter is neutral), but that kind of hypocrisy never does stand well with me. I'm just weird, I guess.

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» Katsono on October 16th, 2016, 8:56am

My answer is Vinland Saga

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» eccentrrick on October 16th, 2016, 11:57am

Hero turning evil. >=D It's more of my style.

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» Damnedman on October 18th, 2016, 11:02am

I get the feeling a lot people think heroes turning evil means them turning anti-hero, i.e. not actually evil. I want to see some actual corruption and turncoating, like with Griffith turning into a demon overlord in Berserk or Superman becoming dictator in Injustice.

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» mikako17 on October 18th, 2016, 8:06pm

Definitely villain to good because like others I am a sap for redemption stories and I like to believe in people.

I've never read hero to evil which I take as vastly different from hero to anti-hero. I've read the latter and probably don't want to read the former because done without brainwashing or something similar, it's just depressing.

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» scorcher on October 19th, 2016, 10:06pm

To me, it has a lot to do with the delivery. When a character decides to change his or her current standing, there must be a good amount of story progression and relate-able events so that I can sympathize or empathize with the change.

Like a good person who gave up on goodness after trying really hard to do good but end up doing nothing (Han Si-Hyun from Trace 1.5: Communicator). Or a bad character who isn't really bad in the first place but is made out to be bad by others (Accelerator from Toaru Majutsu no Index).

Ultimately, I am more interesting in the reasons for their change than the change itself. It's not a simple black and white scenario with good and evil but a grey area which gives individuality and complexity to the character.

I think the last time I enjoy a character changing side is when I read Noblesse with Roctis Karvei.
Spoiler (mouse over to view)
He is genuinely good but decided to do evil in order to protect his evil daughter from the good guys.




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