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Problems with 1/2 Prince

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AceBunneh
Post #485444
Member

7:24 pm, Jul 28 2011
Posts: 235


Um.. Just a mess of thoughts I scribbled down earlier.. My issues with Half Prince.. Bit of a mess since I was in a hurry and doing other things when I typed it down. Any who.. >.>;; Thoughts? Comments? Your own issues with the light novel/manhua..?


Issues with half prince
-You can knock people out? seems kind of dangerous especially with 99% realism
-first player to log on got 1 wish, since different timezones all over the world
-is there an automatic translator? or is second life only a chinese game? not hard to imagine since it's in the future but still, have to wonder..
-since there's 99% realism, couldn't use get blacksmiths and other people to make technology that shouldn't exist in the world of Second Life but exist in reality such as cars? even if you didn't have gas and such you could probably synthesize it and use magic to make up for the rest...?
(I can't help but feel like I'd be evil in a game like Half Life.. I mean, sure it's nice that the main character (I'll just call her Prince since that's easier for me to remember.. Even though I'm Chinese. >.<) used fighting moves and such and attacked in different ways besides just the traditional hacking and slashing (well, slicing, stabbing, etc, etc, etc) with a sword, but well.... For me in a game which is trying to be realistic but is set in a location without as much science and technology but instead relying on magic I'd be tempted to use technology.. I mean, what's stopping me from inventing a gun and mowing down a mob? And there are staffs and other weapons that enhance certain skills or magic.. I'd be tempted to find out what makes it enhance the magic and see if I could use it in some other way.. For example if it was a certain crystal in a staff that enhanced ice magic could I go out and collect a lot of them and make a necklace that greatly enhances my ice magic? If you're going to give me 99% realism I'd just abuse it to the best of my ability and use my knowledge (or research) and create ways to give me an advantage. And of course if all of this wasn't allowed then there wouldn't be 99% realism and the game would be making false claims.



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deets
Post #485445
Member

7:36 pm, Jul 28 2011
Posts: 11


well. I'll answer in order~ ^^

1) yes, I can see how that could be dangerous

2)You don't need to know what TIME they logged on, just how many people are logged on to the server. It's actually a lot simpler than you think.

3) Well. it'd be kind of hard... It's like giving the benjamin franklin an iphone and telling him to make it work. plus, how many day to day things could you just... invent? It takes real genius and stuff to do that. Even if you're in a game. Which with 99% realism, wouldn't make things much easier. Plus, with lack of very, very simple equipment, making a gun's not that easy, slash would take a WHILE. ESPECIALLY if you didn't know how too. It'd be a waste of time to me, really when you can just make do and do just as well with other stuff. Plus, that's the point of games. To give you what you can't already find in real life, I guess... oh, and having a gun doesn't necessarily mean you can mow down a mob. Magic users still need parties to do stuff like that, it's the same with guns. Even archers, too, so... yeah. =p

4) It's not like all of this stuff couldn't happen, I'm sure somewhere in the remote part of the game someone would (maybe) care to try and undertake such endeavors, but it'd take a long time. Really. Especially with the way the game works. It may be 99% realism, but that doesn't mean the game has to be the same as real life. not at all. If it did, it'd really be just a second life. Forget the mobs, you'd be fighting gangs. When you think of these things, it's best to see how you define '99% realism' =p

p.s. actually, I kind of messed up a teeny detail in my 3rd point. It's not like giving ben franklin an iphone (or any kind of cell phone really) and telling him to make it work, it's like telling him to invent a cell phone. Which would probably drive him mad as he wondered where this imaginary device came from. XD

Last edited by deets at 8:04 pm, Jul 28

Jindo
Post #485446
user avatar
Member

7:43 pm, Jul 28 2011
Posts: 6


Well it's just a manhua so I don't really see a problem with it, to me it's a series I can't really take seriously and only read for the laughs.
Hm, I guess the only problem I would have is that it's released bimonthly. ;-;

switchgear
Post #485451
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Member

8:28 pm, Jul 28 2011
Posts: 214


you're really stretching it here eh. It's a video game how can they invent things in a video game that is not already programed by the developers. Even if they did that would be hacking and you would be kicked out.
As for the whole first person gets wish thing I always just assumed that was an excuse what's her name used to allow the change because she was just curious in the results. How else were some many people already be ahead of her if she was the first.

the biggest problem I have is with the story itself. The latest couple of arcs have really screwed with the original idea of the story. When i read the newest arcs I completely forget that Prince is a girl and when was the last time they were outside the game or the bet made at the beginning was brought up. it's turning into dot hack where everything takes place in the game.

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AceBunneh
Post #485454 - Reply to (#485445) by deets
Member

8:41 pm, Jul 28 2011
Posts: 235


Quote from deets
well. I'll answer in order~ ^^

1) yes, I can see how that could be dangerous

2)You don't need to know what TIME they logged on, just how many people are logged on to the server. It's actually a lot simpler than you think.

3) Well. it'd be kind of hard... It's like giving the benjamin franklin an iphone and telling him to make it work. plus, how many day to day things could you just... invent? It takes real genius and stuff to do that. Even if you're in a game. Which with 99% realism, wouldn't make things much easier. Plus, with lack of very, very simple equipment, making a gun's not that easy, slash would take a WHILE. ESPECIALLY if you didn't know how too. It'd be a waste of time to me, really when you can just make do and do just as well with other stuff. Plus, that's the point of games. To give you what you can't already find in real life, I guess... oh, and having a gun doesn't necessarily mean you can mow down a mob. Magic users still need parties to do stuff like that, it's the same with guns. Even archers, too, so... yeah. =p

4) It's not like all of this stuff couldn't happen, I'm sure somewhere in the remote part of the game someone would (maybe) care to try and undertake such endeavors, but it'd take a long time. Really. Especially with the way the game works. It may be 99% realism, but that doesn't mean the game has to be the same as real life. not at all. If it did, it'd really be just a second life. Forget the mobs, you'd be fighting gangs. When you think of these things, it's best to see how you define '99% realism' =p

p.s. actually, I kind of messed up a teeny detail in my 3rd point. It's not like giving ben franklin an iphone (or any kind of cell phone really) and telling him to make it work, it's like telling him to invent a cell phone. Which would probably drive him mad as he wondered where this imaginary device came from. XD


2. I'm not saying that it's hard to tell who logged in first, I'm saying it's completely unfair. (unless it's exclusive to a country) As a person who plays many MMOs that are international or that aren't for my country I know first hand how much it comes up that there are timezone differences.. Many events occur at a certain time when people who I live by are normally sleeping or working or in school or soemthing..
3. I know it takes skill to make things, but think about it like this.. Most of the world's popular was in the game supposedly having left the two other MMOs with (80% realism I think?) to join it. You have a huge workforce of people, many of which are adults and many others.. If you can't do it you can probably find someone who can.. Moreover with magic you can use it to substitute for things you don't have.. You could easily make a steam engine and then power it using fire you create using magic.. Much faster than going by horse or something. And also for a gun you can probably mow down a mob. Archers need to reload after a shot and also aim carefully. Mages need time to cast spells as stronger spells take longer to cast. A gun is often called an equalize but I suppose it isn't.. It takes some skill to use, but if you have those skills you can easily kill. Just aim and squeeze the trigger (basically.. A little more than that..) And you have to realize it doesn't even have to be a nice gun that you might find out in reality now, anything similar could work.. Say you could very easily cast a fire spell to start a small spark.. Maybe a few seconds to do it, but it's weak, it can't do any harm.. If you can create gunpowder then you can use it to create bullets and a barrel then you can just use that tiny spark to fill in the rest. And failing that make cannons to defend your land.. Larger scale so you don't have to worry about all the small parts. You see my point? >.<;; It's about your creativity.. With free range all you need it skills and creativity.. I mean, I'd be a beast mage specializing in fire magic just to be a great blacksmith.. (of course I'd have to know and learn about metal working first..)

Basically when I say gun you might think of a modern gun or something.. But it doesn't have to be like that.. Think of the guns of older times.. A bit crude, not all of them were the same, but they worked.. The hardest part would be making a straight barrel, and a bullet (but it depends how you want the bullet) and of course synthesizing gunpowder..

Also, @switchgear.. It's set in the future with 99% reality.. It's meant to give you freedom in choice and what you do. They didn't exactly go programming self aware NPCs either, and also there are other things to consider.. For example since you seem to be going with the manhua they did reforge and alter the Prince's armor when he met with the leaders from other continents. So you have to put that into consideration.. If there's people who can work as blacksmiths to shape things as they wish, why can't they make slightly more advanced weapons than swords? I'm not saying to go out and build a robot here..

And if you read the light novel she was the first one on supposedly, but she spent hours arguing over and designing her character.. I think two hours or so..

And yes, I agree with you on the latest arcs of the story..

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kayue
Post #485455
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8:53 pm, Jul 28 2011
Posts: 144


I love these books.
.
1) the 99% realism is one thing, but it's only 30%pain. So things are obviously adjustable (ie, 'death'). Otherwise Gui would be an imbecile by now.

2). First player login, could have been Grenwich(sp?) time or wherever the server was.

3). The book says 'world', so I imagine it's worldwide. However considering the 'coincidence' of the players being mainly local. It's possible that geographically close players are grouped near each other when they first start. And they're in dream-states, so I imagine a universal translator.

4). even with a 99% realism, if it isn't programmed into the game, it ain't there. But even if is allowed, technology has it's drawbacks. For example, for a car you'd need to have a machine shop for the parts, a refinery for the gas, gas stations, etc. Why bother when there are horses and other mounts, and carts? Not to mention flying carpets and teleport points.

Same goes for guns. A wand of fireballs (or the equivalent) works just as well, or better, in most fantasy games.

5). As to staffs and crystals. Think of the staff as a rifle and the crystal as the bullet. Without the 'rifle', the 'bullet' is pretty much useless. And you can't hang a bunch of staves around your neck.
Even so, most games only allow one item per body part. On the theory that too many magic items in one place would interfere with each other. Like antenna signals.

I imagine that the "99% realism" claim is in relation to how the game 'feels' to the player's senses. Touch, taste, smell, etc. Even then, it's probably modified like 'pain'. Smell could be a real problem in crowded cities. wink

Btw: if you like Half Prince, I recommend [m]Moonlight Sculptor[/m]. A little more serious, but a great story.

Skinny Kazoo
Post #485458
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9:02 pm, Jul 28 2011
Posts: 146


Other than the knocking out (though couldn't that be the 1% or whatever not realistic), I don't find the lack of guns unrealistic. Just because it is 99% realistic doesn't mean you can invent or use things that aren't programmed into the system

The one thing that really bugs me is the one wish thing...with the amount of time shown that they spend in game, how can she be the first and not be ahead of most other people.

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AceBunneh
Post #485459 - Reply to (#485455) by kayue
Member

9:06 pm, Jul 28 2011
Posts: 235


Quote from kayue
I love these books.
.
1) the 99% realism is one thing, but it's only 30%pain. So things are obviously adjustable (ie, 'death'). Otherwise Gui would be an imbecile by now.

2). First player login, could have been Grenwich(sp?) time or wherever the server was.

3). The book says 'world', so I imagine it's worldwide. However considering the 'coincidence' of the players being mainly local. It's possible that geographically close players are grouped near each other when they first start. And they're in dream-states, so I imagine a universal translator.

4). even with a 99% realism, if it isn't programmed into the game, it ain't there. But even if is allowed, technology has it's drawbacks. For example, for a car you'd need to have a machine shop for the parts, a refinery for the gas, gas stations, etc. Why bother when there are horses and other mounts, and carts? Not to mention flying carpets and teleport points.

Same goes for guns. A wand of fireballs (or the equivalent) works just as well, or better, in most fantasy games.

5). As to staffs and crystals. Think of the staff as a rifle and the crystal as the bullet. Without the 'rifle', the 'bullet' is pretty much useless. And you can't hang a bunch of staves around your neck.
Even so, most games only allow one item per body part. On the theory that too many magic items in one place would interfere with each other. Like antenna signals.

I imagine that the "99% realism" claim is in relation to how the game 'feels' to the player's senses. Touch, taste, smell, etc. Even then, it's probably modified like 'pain'. Smell could be a real problem in crowded cities. wink

Btw: if you like Half Prince, I recommend [m]Moonlight Sculptor[/m]. A little more serious, but a great story.

2. Hm.. Looks like I'll have to edit my first post.. But yes, I know.. I meant it's unfair to all the people in the world who might be sleeping at the time the server comes online and is open to the public..

4. You fail to remember there is magic to replace what you lack, you but only need the knowledge.. By car you can just have a basic cart and four wheels with a steam engine.. Even a basic one of those.. A place for steam to collect and have pressure to move parts.. To boil the water you can use magic or start a fire naturally.. Done, a car. You can replace parts and you can construct it with wood for the most part... People are too rigid in their definition of items. x]]

As for a wand and fireballs perhaps, but if you're not a mage you can't use it. Also, most spells in this world take time to cast and the length of casting seems equivalent to the power of the spell. If you could use small magic combined with technology you'd have a greater advantage.

5. As for the limit of items per body part shouldn't it be limited to how many can realistically fit, although I can see the logic behind the.. "too much magic would interfere with each other" type of thing.. Can't argue that. xP

Finally, thanks for the suggestion of Moonlight Sculptor.. It's on my wish list, but unfortunately I haven't a source for it.. Please note I'm not asking for one in any way and if I said anything to suggest that I'm sorry. =x

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kayue
Post #485461
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Member

9:12 pm, Jul 28 2011
Posts: 144


Re: the guns.

The earliest guns (muskets) were muzzle loaders. Incredibly slow to load, and notoriously unreliable. Their main advantage over bows, was distance and the size of their shot.

I imagine in Second Life, an archer's quiver is always magically full. A top archer with magic arrows would rival a repeating rifle. Or a bard like Gui, or a mage, has magic missiles. Much more fun than a gun

This is a medieval fantasy game after all. smile

You can find Moonlight Sculptor on Odd Squad's Novel Translations site. (Same group that does the Half Prince manga. They've just redone the first book so far. Good translations of rest are very hard to find. I'm struggling through a machine trans of v2 right now.

Last edited by blakraven66 at 3:25 am, Jul 29

AceBunneh
Post #485468 - Reply to (#485461) by kayue
Member

9:26 pm, Jul 28 2011
Posts: 235


Quote from kayue
Re: the guns.

The earliest guns (muskets) were muzzle loaders. Incredibly slow to load, and notoriously unreliable. Their main advantage over bows, was distance and the size of their shot.

I imagine in Second Life, an archer's quiver is always magically full. A top archer with magic arrows would rival a repeating rifle. Or a bard like Gui, or a mage, has magic missiles. Much more fun than a gun

This is a medieval fantasy game after all. smile

I doubt it's always magically full.. You'd have to fill it and buy them, but it's more like subspace where you can fill it with an infinite amount of arrows.. Should you be able to buy that many.. Much like how various pounches and bags contain items that wouldn't fit normally because of their shape and size.

But you're still being a bit rigid with your definition of a gun in my opinion.. And of course I didn't say that guns are more fun than magic, I believe the opposite to be true in fact.. But I'm just that why can't people combine the elements of magic and technology (no matter how basic) to make things...

I mean.. Okay, say a simple pulley system that's used to lift large stones for building a castle is used. What's stopping someoen from making the large wheel into a gear, combining that with a windmill like apparatus (or wind turbine) and then using magic to create some wind? Why go through all the work and use brute force to do things?

Same with the gun.. If your problem with it is accuracy then make buckshot to damage a large area with each shot. You don't have to be rigid and stick with pre-existing designs.. You can use advancements through history as a guide and them design things to suit your abilities and your needs.


Quote from Skinny Kazoo
Other than the knocking out (though couldn't that be the 1% or whatever not realistic), I don't find the lack of guns unrealistic. Just because it is 99% realistic doesn't mean you can invent or use things that aren't programmed into the system

The one thing that really bugs me is the one wish thing...with the amount of time shown that they spend in game, how can she be the first and not be ahead of most other people.


She has school and other things, and she also spent a lot of time researching fighting (apparently) and cooking for her brother.. she probably has homework and other responsibilities also.. It shows her in game a lot, but it doesn't show how much time has passed so it could be she spent a lot of time on the game over a long period of time whereas others spent more time in the game.. Also you have to think about the skill of people.. Maybe they gathered larger groups or more talented people and killed things more efficiently and faster to gain exp faster.


Also, people keep saying you can't use things not programmed into the game.. Okay, let's say that's true for the moment.. So did they program the full range of movement possible for humans? What about the changes in clothing people are applying? The designs of their buildings and their plans for a bookstore? The writing gives off the idea that you have free range.. I'm not saying a gun in the traditional sense you may think of now, like a hang held semi-automatic or something..

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