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General No.6
Post #590660
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9:42 am, Mar 13 2013
Posts: 94


So now this makes him Uryu's second cousin...? eek

Lonegun
Post #590672
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12:01 pm, Mar 13 2013
Posts: 14


Not necessarily, she was taken in by the Ishidas, but just cus' she calls Ryuken's mother aunt doesn't mean they are related.

What I thought was interesting was what that the hollow kinda looked like Ichigo's final Visored form, from his fight with Ulquiorra.

http://mangafox.me/manga/bleach/v41/c350/5.html

strixflash
Post #590674 - Reply to (#590672) by Lonegun
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Noblesse Forever!
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12:05 pm, Mar 13 2013
Posts: 1002


Quote from Lonegun
What I thought was interesting was what that the hollow kinda looked like Ichigo's final Visored form, from his fight with Ulquiorra.


Thinking it's some foreshadowing?

Then the Quincy King's probably Masaki's father who after death was able to escape from soul society or something along those lines? He has a time limit, right?

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Lonegun
Post #590675
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12:09 pm, Mar 13 2013
Posts: 14


Well, I don´t think Kubo Tite is very good at foreshadowing, but lately he's been connecting a lot of dots, it being the final arc and everything, it's certainly possible.

TheMob
Post #590689
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5:17 pm, Mar 13 2013
Posts: 142


Dude...! That was totally Ichigo's hollow form!
So does this mean that ichigo is neither shinigami nor quincy but actually a hollow manifested as a human confused

Or even better...msybe Kubo's gonna pull a Naruto and reveal that Ichigo's parents sealed the hollow they couldn't defeat into their kid biggrin

Last edited by TheMob at 5:25 pm, Mar 13

jrdragon2003
Post #590695 - Reply to (#590689) by TheMob
Member

7:15 pm, Mar 13 2013
Posts: 674


If he did do something like that, it would be the dumbest idea in the world. For one it would be blatant plagiarism, plus when have any Shinigami sealed a Hollow before? Their sole existence is mainly for purifying souls in general, and Hollows are souls too. the only thing I can say that would go along with you were trying to imply would be Ichigo being reincarnated from the purification process of the Hollow. But then again all of the souls that go through that take years upon years to even be allowed that.

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Amuris
Post #590697
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7:28 pm, Mar 13 2013
Posts: 20


when did they say how long it takes to reincarnate? Also, I'm not sure if we can expect consistency with Kubo anymore or not. He's doing better now but still. Anyway, it might just be how he explains how she died. Yeah this chapter they say she sucks as a Quincy but later she could drive that vaselorde looking hollow away. Having Ichigo go berserk and kill his own mom during the attack from grand fisher(and having Ishin blame the whole thing on grandfisher and not his son) would make more sense by this point.

Also, it won't be plagiarism. It would of had to been something unique to naruto like specific characters, abilities, or events. Sealing an evil spirit in some child of destiny(I guess that's what he's going for though he still needs to get off ichigo's crotch and focus on his better more interesting characters) is just a trope. It's been done before naruto and, as a general writing convention, no one can claim it.

Lonegun
Post #590707
Member

8:32 pm, Mar 13 2013
Posts: 14


Ichigo has demonstrated abilities of pretty much all the canon races, Shinigami obviously, Visored, it could be argued that in his fight with Ulquiorra he went full Hollow (Vastrode level at that) and then unmasked himself, like an Arrancar, Full bringer when he lost his Shinigami powers and now Quincy,

I think he absorbs spiritual power and mimics the abilities of pretty much any race, but his power hasn't matured yet.

jrdragon2003
Post #590708 - Reply to (#590697) by Amuris
Member

8:50 pm, Mar 13 2013
Posts: 674


The basis of my opinion on the reincarnation is based off of S.S and it's shear amount of souls that are outside of it waiting to be reborn again if at all. All souls usually have to go through S.S to do anything in the first place anyway.

As tragic a story that would be from what you pointed out, I highly doubt it'll happen, Ichigo's power in general wasn't that high as a kid, his powers grew definitely. But to reach a point of killing an adult with powers of a Quincy seems highly unlikely. Especially since they specialize in taking Reiatsu from everything, Hollow's are just negative Reiatsu.

And it really is plagiarism if he's taking the exact same idea, on someone who's already put the idea into use. It's not something everybody sees or notices, but when an idea is already published and put into print from an artist or company, it's rights are already sealed to whoever is the owner or creator, or whatever agreement was made for it. Now Naruto's main plot line is him being a heroic character with a monster sealed inside of him by his parents to prevent it from destroying him and others around him. If Kubo did this with Ichigo, he'd be ripping off Kishimoto. Granted they may work for the same company, but a lazy attempt like that would make Kishimoto made and he could file against that. And the company they work for wouldn't be happy about that kind of turn out either. So in the end it is pretty much plagiarism, if he's totally ripping off an idea, regardless of changing who the characters doing it are.

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silent killer
Post #590731 - Reply to (#590672) by Lonegun
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chasing oblivion
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1:04 am, Mar 14 2013
Posts: 1366


Quote from Lonegun
Not necessarily, she was taken in by the Ishidas, but just cus' she calls Ryuken's mother aunt doesn't mean they are related.

What I thought was interesting was what that the hollow kinda looked like Ichigo's final Visored form, from his fight with Ulquiorra.

http://mangafox.me/manga/bleach/v41/c3 ...

ugh. linking to mangafox is bad. In many ways. Aside from that, it's not unheard of that a branch family member marries into the main branch. Given the conversation whats his face had with the maid leads credence to them being related rather than not.

On a further aside, How many people didn't see this coming. Cuz damn, was it obvious.

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xdude101
Post #590743 - Reply to (#590708) by jrdragon2003
Member

3:55 am, Mar 14 2013
Posts: 109


Quote from jrdragon2003
And it really is plagiarism if he's taking the exact same idea, on someone who's already put the idea into use.


Being fair, it wouldn't be the first plagiarism to come out of Bleach. Rukia killed Aeroniero with a weapon taken from Flame of Recca. Hado #3 (Byakurai) is basically the spirit gun from Yu Yu Hakusho. Shounen mangas steal ideas from one another all the time. Actually, I'm surprised we didn't see Yamamoto use the spirit bomb against Juhabach.

I agree that the whole sealing the hollow inside Ichigo thing would be stupid though. The explanation for why he has a hollow form is already established by the method of transformation that restored his shinigami powers the first time. So there's really no need to retcon a "naruto's birth" scene.

Quote
Ichigo's power in general wasn't that high as a kid, his powers grew definitely.


Ichigo's power was high as a kid though, hence his mother's death. I remember the explanation that Ishida made during their contest to kill the most hollows. That Ichigo's spirit power was like a faucet and when he turned it on full blast he instinctively turned it off as much as he could (like, say, after his mom died in front of his eyes), but when the little girl's ghost touched him, it started leaking out more, then he took Rukia's powers, and fought stronger and stronger enemies (hollows and shinigami and vaizard and arrancar) until BAM, he's better than all the captains combined for one bright moment until he loses it all again.

Last edited by xdude101 at 4:02 am, Mar 14

Amuris
Post #590766
Member

8:15 am, Mar 14 2013
Posts: 20


no no that isn't how plagiarism works. There are certain things which cannot legally be claimed. That is one of them. You can't win a case unless it is something unique to another property. It isn't just a matter of them publishing it. YOU CAN'T OWN GENERAL STORY THEMES. Sealing demons in kids is not specific enough to claim ownership. It doesn't matter if naruto did it. It's the same as making a story about a lonely kid who makes a bunch of friends, a post-apocalyptic future, or a horror story. It's a general story mechanic like a genre and no one owns it.

also, I find it odd that we expect better at this point. I'm happy that it feels like he's seriously trying to reach the conclusion. I don't expect Kubo to suddenly become creative. If anything, that would worry me. His creativity usually results in random powers being thrown in for the main character to get like this was a self-insertion fanfic done by a 12-year old.

Last edited by Amuris at 8:22 am, Mar 14

Bagdemagus
Post #590814
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Member

7:40 pm, Mar 14 2013
Posts: 94


At least there's going to be some sense into why Aizen confessed to ichigo. By the way, looks like ichigo is a reincarnated hollow?

animephreak
Post #590932
Member

7:19 pm, Mar 15 2013
Posts: 51


Kubo seems to have a thing for horns pointing forwards like that. There have been several other hollows and arrancar with those type of horns. I really don't see any resemblance to Ichigo's "complete" or "incomplete" hollow forms. And the idea that the hollow somehow becomes Ichigo? That just doesn't make sense.

I think it was pretty clearly shown how Ichigo became a visored previously. As he had been returned to a normal human after being run through by Byakuya, he was then able to transform into a hollow if his soul chain was cut. It wasn't until he was able to find his "own shinigami powers" when his inner world was crumbling that he got full control of his powers. Byakuya has only aimed for the Shinigami powers taken from Rukia, never noticing that Ichigo had powers of his own.

Ichigo almost turned into a hollow as he was regaining his shinigami powers, which resulted in him gaining a hollow aspect to his power, in the form of the mask that protected him, and could come forward to take over at times.

What is in question now is how exactly someone "becomes" a quincy, and how they are trained as such. It seems that they need to have some natural aptitude for it, and that this, like high spiritual power in Shinigami, runs in families. They however would have to awaken it somehow. That would seem to be what Ichigo has done. Maybe Blut Vene and Blut Arterial aren't really techniques, but just natural occurrences is those that have the aptitude.

FormX
Post #590934 - Reply to (#590932) by animephreak
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7:34 pm, Mar 15 2013
Posts: 680


Quote from animephreak
Kubo seems to have a thing for horns pointing forwards like that. There have been several other hollows and arrancar with those type of horns. I really don't see any resemblance to Ichigo's "complete" or "incomplete" hollow forms. And the idea that the hollow somehow becomes Ichigo? ...


You can see for yourself.
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It's not exact, but there is the resemblance.

The answer to all this?
Aizen
Remember what he told Ichigo when they fought in 397.

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