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kitty1826x
Post #625006
user avatar
Me too ♥
Member

7:40 pm, Dec 17 2013
Posts: 742


There's a bit of a problem with manga having both Hentai, and Borderline H placed in them.
As Baalzebup nicely words it - Either a manga is H or it is not. It cannot be borderline if it is H, and if it is just borderline, it is never H. Those are mutually exclusive.

Quote from lynira from Categories(Tags) bugs thread
It is a problem, but the trouble is that fixing it is very difficult. Obviously only one of them should stay, but without having read a series, I don't know which to remove. (I haven't read any of the series in question and don't plan to.) Also, the fact that they're labeled both borderline H and hentai might even mean that there's disagreement about which a series is, which makes it even harder. I feel like I shouldn't just quickly take a person's word for it without some proof/explanation (e.g., "I have read most of this series and every single chapter contains explicit intercourse scenes").


To try to help out the situation.
Please check this list, to see if you have read any of the titles.
If you have read any could you write the proof/explanation of which tag needs to stay in a comment below.

EDIT:
If you could start each proof/explanation with
I have read (manga from list) and (tag) should stay (other tag) should be deleted because ....


*For borderline H I think all of the series should have been read.
For Hentai if you can explain the one explicit scene that qualifies it as so should be enough. (with said what chapter and page(s) would be better.)

Please only comments trying to help the issue. (meaning I've have read etc.)

Last edited by Kitty18dnsz at 7:35 pm, Dec 22

________________
Yes yes I know I make longwinded comments, but that's just me >.<
I should proof read my comments more, but I won't ... I really should though >.>
So keep in mind I'm filled with typos

Reading FAQ and Forum Rules is very helpful ... so go read them if you haven't yet. Ex. -You could find out how to link mangas. Along with other useful things.
Knightzomegaz
Post #625472
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12b~Golem Guardian
 Member

6:32 pm, Dec 21 2013
Posts: 945


Uhm, do you only classify a borderline H manga as a hentai if it have Intercourse? Try Nyatto!, as Ecchi as Colorful Harvest, but it is not classified as a hentai?
Well, when I was still new here in manga updates, whenever I see a hentai genre on a manga, I already classify it as a hentai, not as a manga.. But just recently, I learned that some mangas are with a hentai genre(uhm, do you call the hentai a genre or a tag?) but is not actually hentai..

oh, by the way, thanks for that Link...

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kitty1826x
Post #625479
user avatar
Me too ♥
Member

7:06 pm, Dec 21 2013
Posts: 742


I'm not asking for any suggestions. I'm trying to help out the database with this small problem with these labeling.

The manga in the list have both Hentai, and borderline H. (That is the problem).

What I'm asking is to check out the link, and see if you've read anything on it.
If you have then is you could please say which tag needs to stay the Hentai tag or Borderline H tag.
In saying which one has to stay, explain why.

Ex. (Manga name from link) need to keep it's hentai tag because ___ and ___ happens in it. It is way pass Borderline H, and the Borderline H tag needs to be deleted.
or
(Different manga from link) is just Borderline H, there's ____ but no ____. So the Hentai tag needs to be deleted.



Sorry if I was unclear in the OP.

Last edited by Kitty18dnsz at 7:27 pm, Dec 21

________________
Yes yes I know I make longwinded comments, but that's just me >.<
I should proof read my comments more, but I won't ... I really should though >.>
So keep in mind I'm filled with typos

Reading FAQ and Forum Rules is very helpful ... so go read them if you haven't yet. Ex. -You could find out how to link mangas. Along with other useful things.
Tripitaka
Post #625492
user avatar
Go on, go.
Member

10:24 pm, Dec 21 2013
Posts: 415


I'd say HARUMI Chihiro's Cutie Lips belongs to the Borderline H group because most of her scanlated works have been classified as adult and as ecchi or as mature but not as Hentai, and they're all similar when it comes to their degree and their amount of graphic scenes. Even though they're serialised in a Hentai magazine. Either this or her other works need to be labeled as Hentai as well.


________________
"Stories are what death thinks he puts an end to.
He can't understand that they end in him, but they don't end with him."
- Ursula K. Le Guin, Gifts


To be savoured:
- Blood Alone by TAKANO Masayuki
- Otoyomegatari by MORI Kaoru
- Gangsta. by Kohske
- Seishun Kouryakuhon by AKIZUKI Sorata
kitty1826x
Post #625498 - Reply to (#625492) by Tripitaka
user avatar
Me too ♥
Member

11:17 pm, Dec 21 2013
Posts: 742


Sorry to push for a better explanation but could you give one?
I think saying -This author mostly makes Borderline H, and thus this one from the list should get rid of the hentai tag isn't sufficient enough for a mod to remove the unneeded tag and lock it.

Maybe something more along the lines of I've read all of Cutie Lips and all the scenes fit well within the range for Borderline H, just like the rest of her work.

Your comment makes it seem like an assumption based on reading the other works.

Thanks for helping out.

... You know thinking about it. If you had looked at the list, saw a green check mark, and make your comment on this thread. That's pretty much implying you have read it. Especially with the thread title of have you read any of these .... But to be on the safe side (since most don't read everything in topics. I'm not saying you didn't I know you mostly likely did) It would be best if you state I have read.



Edit: In respond to Tripitaka 2nd post sounds a lot clearer to me, but I'm not a mod so it's not up to me, heh.

Last edited by Kitty18dnsz at 5:21 pm, Dec 22

________________
Yes yes I know I make longwinded comments, but that's just me >.<
I should proof read my comments more, but I won't ... I really should though >.>
So keep in mind I'm filled with typos

Reading FAQ and Forum Rules is very helpful ... so go read them if you haven't yet. Ex. -You could find out how to link mangas. Along with other useful things.
dalek
Post #625505
user avatar
grrrrrrrrl
Member

1:59 am, Dec 22 2013
Posts: 889


I'm reading Cutie Lips right now (hentai that sounds interesting, yay!). But... I have read Nozoki Ana and I can say Cutie Lips has the same kind of sex scenes that the first has, so I guess "Ecchi" and "Borderline H" fits Cutie Lips better.

It is hard for me to understand the subtle difference between the two (I understand what hentai and borderline H are, but I don't know how much explicit it is needed to be classified as hentai?).

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Tripitaka
Post #625550 - Reply to (#625498) by kitty1826x
user avatar
Go on, go.
Member

1:56 pm, Dec 22 2013
Posts: 415


Sorry for the confusion. I've read Cutie Lips of course. As you have mentioned above, I automatically assumed that people should only post their opinions on this thread if they have read any of the listed works. Let me rephrase my first explanation:

I consider Cutie Lips by HARUMI Chihiro to be rather Borderline H and Ecchi than Hentai because it focuses on the characters' relationships. The very graphic sex scenes are only an additional feature. As dalek stated already, they are comparable to the ones in Nozoki Ana, so they could be confused with censored Hentai scenes if it weren't for the plot. Take Work Hard! as an example.
Spoiler (mouse over to view)
A salaryman is interested in a bright and diligent 20-year-old part-timer at his company but worries about their age gap. A refusal at work leads her to misunderstand him but they manage to clear it up while going out for dinner. They confess their love for each other. A sex scene follows. In the end, she gets promoted to a full-time office worker, and they get their workplace-romance happy ending.
Same goes for the mangaka's other works Velvet Kiss and Koi wo Suru no ga Shigoto desu which are all a combination of personal drama, workplace romance and slice of life.
In short, you can read HARUMI Chihiro's manga and leave out the sex scenes without missing any important plot points. If they were classic Hentai, you wouldn't have anything left without the sex. So, the Borderline H tag should stay whereas Hentai needs to be deleted and Ecchi should be added.

I hope this helped to clarify my first post.


Last edited by Tripitaka at 3:33 pm, Dec 22

________________
"Stories are what death thinks he puts an end to.
He can't understand that they end in him, but they don't end with him."
- Ursula K. Le Guin, Gifts


To be savoured:
- Blood Alone by TAKANO Masayuki
- Otoyomegatari by MORI Kaoru
- Gangsta. by Kohske
- Seishun Kouryakuhon by AKIZUKI Sorata
mu2020
Post #625555
user avatar
the mu...
Member

3:06 pm, Dec 22 2013
Posts: 1027


wont the genre(s) of a manga be based on the magazine it serialized on? (objectively) not from what it contain..
while the tag(s) be based on what it contain. (subjectively)

meaning that if it is serialized in that particular magazine, it is automatically got the hentai genre.

as for borderline h, well that's just a tag... right?... if you think that that tag cannot be put on a hentai manga, then blame whoever put that tag there in the first place...

if it is something like it has both a shoujo and a hentai genre, now then we have a problem.... (just an example...)

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dalek
Post #625568 - Reply to (#625555) by mu2020
user avatar
grrrrrrrrl
Member

5:14 pm, Dec 22 2013
Posts: 889


Quote from mu2020
wont the genre(s) of a manga be based on the magazine it serialized on? (objectively) not from what it contain..
while the tag(s) be based on what it contain. (subjectively)

meaning that if it is serialized in that particular magazine, it is automatically got the hentai genre.

as for borderline h, ...


But what about those who have shoujo/shounen and yuri as genres, for example? I think it's helpful, because when I see both of them together I kinda understand that it's a shoujo-like story with yuri elements. Same goes for ecchi genre in a manga that is serialized on a hentai magazine... when I do advanced search, I consider ecchi but exclude hentai, so even though it's on a hentai magazine, it would be more helpful to classify as ecchi for those who like borderline H (having shounen and ecchi, I understand it is a shounen-like story but with ecchi elements... if I see hentai and shounen, it doesn't matter if it has shounen, since having "hentai" classifies the story as "focusing only on sex"). I don't know if I made it more confusing or if I made my opinion clear...

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kitty1826x
Post #625569 - Reply to (#625555) by mu2020
user avatar
Me too ♥
Member

5:15 pm, Dec 22 2013
Posts: 742


As I had stated in the OP it is a small problem.

Would you care to look up all 75 manga on that list, and tell me if the magazine said it was hentai?

The problem is MU Staff have no idea which one is right. They (and myself) don't want to go through the trouble or A) reading something they are not interested in, and B) look up which if it was a hentai when published in whatever magazine. (I understand they are busy with other MU related things, and also have their own lives, and just help out the site in their free time). (As for me. I'm actually busy making this one thread that will hopefully help out with some of the clutter in the forums. *sigh* just thinking about it gets me sad. *sigh* this is going to be a long week... also not the point)


Quote
as for borderline h, well that's just a tag... right?... if you think that that tag cannot be put on a hentai manga, then blame whoever put that tag there in the first place...
Yeah because putting blame on someone would be the right thing to do, not fix the conflicting tags.

It creates a problem when someone like myself would be okay with a Borderline H story, but not Hentai. So when I conduct my own search and exclude Hentai. I'm missing out on what could be a nice Borderline H manga.



Thus I find the easiest way to solve this minor problem. Would be to see if others have read those manga, and have them spare a minute or two explaining which needs to go.

Now if you don't have any comments to help out, please don't post anything. Seeing as you have not read any of them, and just wanted to say what's the big deal. The thread was made to help out the issue, not to be discussed. (I have no intentions of making this sound rude or hostile. If it's coming off that way.)


EDIT-
In response to mu2020's post below.
Quote
sorry for not being clear with the sarcasm. if you don't agree by a certain tag then just vote and press disagree. and ask other to do the same.... democracy... campaign...
for some people some tags maybe conflicting but not for others.. that is why we vote for the "category tags"
Yes you do vote down tags you don't agree with, and when it gets enough votes that disagree you report it to the Categories(Tags) bugs thread so someone could remove those tags.
Let's take for ex. Incest. There are people who would rather not read a story about Incest, but if it turns out that it's a false incest, but it still has the tag of incest. When that person does a search and excludes incest. They are missing out on a story that they would be okay with. (again not the point of this thread)

I'll state again the intent of this thread is to help out this minor issue. Not to discuss the route on what would be a better way, or the bigger problem is this instead, etc.

If you want to go ahead and look up all 75 manga to see if they were published as hentai to help out sure go ahead, and do that. (That would be the best way to help out the minor issue). If you don't want to help out the problem by saying " I've read ___ and ___ tag needs to be removed" fine then, you have no reason to make a post in this thread. If you want to make a different thread about what the problems of this site is, and options to help out, go ahead. However, this thread is just for helping get rid of either the Hentai, or Borderline H tags, in the mangas that have both.

Last edited by Kitty18dnsz at 8:03 pm, Dec 22

________________
Yes yes I know I make longwinded comments, but that's just me >.<
I should proof read my comments more, but I won't ... I really should though >.>
So keep in mind I'm filled with typos

Reading FAQ and Forum Rules is very helpful ... so go read them if you haven't yet. Ex. -You could find out how to link mangas. Along with other useful things.
mu2020
Post #625581 - Reply to (#625568) by dalek
user avatar
the mu...
Member

7:12 pm, Dec 22 2013
Posts: 1027


Quote from dalek
But what about those who have shoujo/shounen and yuri as genres, for example? I think it's helpful, because when I see both of them together I kinda understand that it's a shoujo-like story with yuri elements. Same goes for ecchi genre in a manga that is serialized on a hentai magazine... when I d ...

then.... you should change your view ^_^ no i'm not trolling
i said this because i've seen this before: some unknown users change the genre of some series because for them the story is "shoujo-like" or "josei-like" or "shounen-like" and so on, even though the series themselves are serialized as the opposite...

again... stuff like shoujo, shounen, seinen, josei, and hentai are based on the magazine they come out on right? (please correct me if i'm wrong.) it's already set that way according to it's publisher. so if it is from a hentai manga... then it is a hentai...

Quote from Kitty18dnsz
Yeah because putting blame on someone would be the right thing to do, not fix the conflicting tags.

sorry for not being clear with the sarcasm. if you don't agree by a certain tag then just vote and press disagree. and ask other to do the same.... democracy... campaign...
for some people some tags maybe conflicting but not for others.. that is why we vote for the "category tags"

Quote from Kitty18dnsz
It creates a problem when someone like myself would be okay with a Borderline H story, but not Hentai. So when I conduct my own search and exclude Hentai. I'm missing out on what could be a nice Borderline H manga.

i believe this is a general problem of having the "category tag"-ing system which we all have to live with.. or find a way around it ourself. it's kind of like problem with wikipedia...
example: i can input a random tags on a some random mangas that has nothing to do with the mangas..... and vote huge number of "agree" through the means of clone usernames.. just for the fun of leading people astray.... (don't worry mod, i won't)

the fastest way to go around this is to ask for recommendations: looking for hentai that has a plot and focus less on sex... or has little to non visible sex scene... or stuff like that

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lynira
Post #629453
user avatar
Site Admin

3:00 am, Jan 22 2014
Posts: 414


Quote from Tripitaka
I consider Cutie Lips by HARUMI Chihiro to be rather Borderline H and Ecchi than Hentai because it focuses on the characters' relationships. The very graphic sex scenes are only an additional feature.
Ok, I removed hentai genre from Cutie Lips, leaving it as borderline H. As for ecchi, since you have read it I just want to confirm, does Cutie Lips contain mild perversion and/or fanservice? (From the description and from what you've said, it obviously contains sexual themes and sex scenes, but I can't tell if it contains ecchi, which is more mild.)

Some quick clarifications:
On MangaUpdates, the definition of the hentai genre is strict: "Adult sexual content in an illustrated form where the FOCUS of the manga is placed on sexually graphic acts." So if the intercourse isn't the focus of the manga, it's not considered hentai here. If it's not sexually graphic, it's also not considered hentai here. Please keep this in mind when explaining whether or not a series is either hentai or borderline H.

Because of this strict definition, whether or not a series is hentai on this website is not determined by magazine, it is determined by individual series content (that is to say, it's not considered a demographic here).

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nodas
Post #632466
user avatar
Member

11:28 am, Feb 12 2014
Posts: 29


I have read 41/47 of this list, problem is my current completed manga list is around the 4000 something mark, which makes it very hard to remember the content of most of these series, nevertheless i still remember some of them, so let me add my insight.

Yellow Heart by YONEKURA Kengo is definitely not hentai, as it focuses more on story less on sex, i could compare it even with Blood Rain or Kyou Kara Hitman in terms of content as its like seinen with graphic sex scenes, so it should remain as Borderline H instead of Hentai.

Virgin na Kankei , Virgin na Kankei R , Nurse o Kanojo ni Suru Houhou
Love Comedy Style , Tenshi no Marshmellow should remain as Hentai, as they contain at least one sex scene in each chapter, which makes them focusing more on the sexual act rather in the story, though that doesnt mean they dont have a story aswell (plot with porn should apply on these), on the other hand the same could apply on Futari Ecchi, as the whole manga at its core is a sex guide but i dont see the hentai genre for that one. So if Futari Ecchi doesnt deserve the hentai tag, then none of the aforementioned titles should be hentai aswell.

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