manga04_jpg login_tab_left_jpg
Username:   Password:    Forgot Password?
App
Try out our new iPhone application!
App
Manga Poll
After finishing a series that you like, you most hope to find
Anime of it
Sequel or spin-off
Another series by the same author
Merchandise for sale
Fan fiction
Fan art
A community to discuss the series with
I don't finish series
I have no hope for anything
 
See Old Polls

Manga is the Japanese equivalent of comics
with a unique style and following. Join the revolution! Read some manga today!

Coded in ConTEXT

Join #baka-updates @irc.irchighway.net

RSS Feed
 
center_left_tab Forums center_right_tab

You are now viewing a topic.

World War II

Back to Chatter Box


Pages (4) [ 1 2 3 4 ] Next You must be registered to post!
From User Message Body
Nisseman
Post #152496
user avatar
A bomb!
Member

4:05 pm, Apr 10 2008
Posts: 479


Lets stop discussing this before we starts to totally misunderstand each other =P

Dr. Love
Post #152498
user avatar
 Moderator

4:09 pm, Apr 10 2008
Posts: 8863


Psshaw, it's all in the name of a good conversation~ xP

But anyways, war is bad, mmkay kids? User Posted Image

________________
source: animenewsnetwork

Join SRoMU Scanlations or visit #SRoMU at IRCHighWay.
ares6
Post #152500
user avatar
Member

4:11 pm, Apr 10 2008
Posts: 2896

Warn: Banned



Yep, As Einstein said, WW 4 will be fought with sticks and stones.

________________
Life, what would it be without so much wrongs and rights?


Star Trek XI http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZiR-NETDr0
azzy
Post #152509
Member

4:25 pm, Apr 10 2008
Posts: 14


meh... i agree with nisseman this is going to go nowhere except ppl being pissed at each other. but i might aswell join the fun bigrazz

i have heard all the arguments, how the nukes were really just an act of "mercy" how an invasion would have been much worse, how all the japanese kids would have suicided by throwing themselves off a cliff and all that BS.

but the thing is japan would have accepted to a CONDITIONAL surrender, they would have surrendered if the authority of the emperor was respected but no, america needed full and utter defeat for revenge of pearl harbor and all the lives they lost.

so yeah i don't think it was mercy it was revenge. mercy would have been to accepted that type for surrender.

but atleast america has taken responsibility for their actions, they helped rebuild and protect japan afterwards, unlike japan who still pretends to have done nothing to china and korea.

ahoaho
Post #152516 - Reply to (#152509) by azzy
user avatar
Smooth Operator
Super Mod

4:39 pm, Apr 10 2008
Posts: 5328


Quote from azzy
meh... i agree with nisseman this is going to go nowhere except ppl being pissed at each other. but i might aswell join the fun bigrazz

i have heard all the arguments, how the nukes were really just an act of "mercy" how an invasion would have been much worse, how all the japanese kids would have suicided by throwing themselves off a cliff and all that BS.

but the thing is japan would have accepted to a CONDITIONAL surrender, they would have surrendered if the authority of the emperor was respected but no, america needed full and utter defeat for revenge of pearl harbor and all the lives they lost.

so yeah i don't think it was mercy it was revenge. mercy would have been to accepted that type for surrender.

but atleast america has taken responsibility for their actions, they helped rebuild and protect japan afterwards, unlike japan who still pretends to have done nothing to china and korea.

On what do you base your opinion?

________________
Listen here
Livin just to keep from dyin
User Posted Image
jarejare
Post #152533 - Reply to (#152257) by Identity Crisis
user avatar
Member

5:04 pm, Apr 10 2008
Posts: 12


Quote from thezombieking
) i think that if they went about it differently they could have actually came out on top, don't get me wrong, i don't support them in the least for what they did to people and such, but it all seems like shoty planning to me.


I don't think they could have come out on top. Hitler won some pretty risky gambles(Ruhr Area, Anshluss), only because of those was he able to become a threat. He was standing on the edge all the time. He was able to take over Poland, (which wasn't a very well armed country at the time) with the Blitzkrieg, run over the French because of the badly planned thought-to-be-invincible Maginot-line, and get to Moscow because of Stalin's sheer stupidity.

________________
You're teasing me now?
"You have fewer emeralds of madness
than a beggar has kopeks!"
But remember!
When they teased Vesuvius,
Pompeii perished!

A Cloud in Trousers by Mayakovsky
SliceA1A
Post #154780
user avatar
Member

4:36 pm, Apr 17 2008
Posts: 51


Ah, my favorite subject in the world... I'll keep it short

The atomic bombings were supposed to accomplish two things

1. End the war quickly. After V-E day, Russia declared war on Japan and began to move into Manchuria. We (the Allies) liberated countries from the Axis. Stalinist Russia conquered Nazi held countries to keep for themselves. The longer the war progressed, the more territory Russia would occupy.

2. Force Japan into an unconditional surrender. This is what really saved Japan's butt. One of the conditions of the surrender was that Japan was to surrender on the condition that the United States would occupy them. This was much more acceptable than carbon copying the Germany partitioning. Can you imagine Hokkaido under Soviet rule until the 1990's? Scary.

I could go on but these are the two main points that have been discussed here. We could go on about the humanity of targeting civilians (both in Germany and Japan)

Gany
Post #154792 - Reply to (#152533) by jarejare
user avatar
 Member

5:49 pm, Apr 17 2008
Posts: 165


Quote from jarejare
I don't think they could have come out on top. Hitler won some pretty risky gambles(Ruhr Area, Anshluss), only because of those was he able to become a threat. He was standing on the edge all the time. He was able to take over Poland, (which wasn't a very well armed country at the time) with the Blitzkrieg, run over the French because of the badly planned thought-to-be-invincible Maginot-line, and get to Moscow because of Stalin's sheer stupidity.


Well thought out. Your "badly planned thought-to-be-invincible Maginot-Line" is hilarious.

However, had he let the strategic decisions to his generals the war would have ended later. Stalin wasn't totally stupid either, he just needed time to regroup and fight back.

Indreju
Post #154818 - Reply to (#152533) by jarejare
user avatar
Super Mod

7:40 pm, Apr 17 2008
Posts: 1325


Quote from jarejare
...He was able to take over Poland, (which wasn't a very well armed country at the time) with the Blitzkrieg, run over the French because of the badly planned thought-to-be-invincible Maginot-line, and get to Moscow because of Stalin's sheer stupidity.

Hey, at least WE were fighting. Even with that massive army and Poland still weak after the WWI, Hitler still needed a lot of time to take it over. Shame, that all the countries that were Poland's allies at the time have just left it alone ( thank you France, thank you Britain)...and then was the agression of Sovients ( September 17th)...

I advise you all to be careful with this topic. Really careful.

________________
User Posted Image
Still the bad cop.
Nashnir
Post #154825
user avatar
Member

8:05 pm, Apr 17 2008
Posts: 630


I don't have anything against anyone in this world but I doubt Britain and France really helped France as an ally. I believe it was just to keep their position as super powers at that time in the worlds. But we all know how in the end it turned out for France and Britain was probably saved sue to the coming of Russia and America in the picture against Hitler.

________________
User Posted Image

And here we go.
bedob
Post #154846
user avatar
Thirsty Dog
Member

9:03 pm, Apr 17 2008
Posts: 1027


stalin had a problem (beside being egomaniac and mass murderer)...before the war he sent most of the russian generals (capable ones) to siberia and had unexperienced ones to lead the army (and not enough tanks)...

btw one of my grandfathers served for allies and other for axis...so this rant reminds me of the two of them arguing whose trenches were dirtier and who spent more time in the woods waiting in ambushes...still both of them agree it's good that allies won...

regarding the bombing i don't think it was revenge or something like that, people on the top rarely succumb to such ways...they probably had best and worst scenario cases, casualty expectations and of course the resources, i'm sure it's much cheaper to fuel a bomber than lunch fullscale invasion
...guess the biggest bomb wins



________________
If the sea were made of Whiskey and I was a duck
I'd swim to the bottom and never come up
Panic!182
Post #154851 - Reply to (#154818) by Indreju
user avatar
Member

9:25 pm, Apr 17 2008
Posts: 235


Quote from Indreju
Quote from jarejare
...He was able to take over Poland, (which wasn't a very well armed country at the time) with the Blitzkrieg, run over the French because of the badly planned thought-to-be-invincible Maginot-line, and get to Moscow because of Stalin's sheer stupidity.

Hey, at least WE were fighting. Even with that massive army and Poland still weak after the WWI, Hitler still needed a lot of time to take it over. Shame, that all the countries that were Poland's allies at the time have just left it alone ( thank you France, thank you Britain)...and then was the agression of Sovients ( September 17th)...

I advise you all to be careful with this topic. Really careful.


Actually, the reason Britain and France entered the war because of the invasion of poland. The only country that should be truely P.O.'d is Czechoslovakia.

________________
Common sense just isn't that common
Identity Crisis
Post #155817 - Reply to (#152533) by jarejare
user avatar
Ever the optimist
Super Mod

7:01 pm, Apr 21 2008
Posts: 4881


Quote from jarejare
Quote from thezombieking
) i think that if they went about it differently they could have actually came out on top, don't get me wrong, i don't support them in the least for what they did to people and such, but it all seems like shoty planning to me.


I don't think they could have come out on top. Hitler won some pretty risky gambles(Ruhr Area, Anshluss), only because of those was he able to become a threat. He was standing on the edge all the time. He was able to take over Poland, (which wasn't a very well armed country at the time) with the Blitzkrieg, run over the French because of the badly planned thought-to-be-invincible Maginot-line, and get to Moscow because of Stalin's sheer stupidity.



While its true that he came out on top, for some time, that was pure luck that he managed to get as far as he did, which is why i said, if it was better thought out, he could had won...

For instance, if he had left Poland, France, and other countries on that side, alone, he could had killed Stalin, taken Russia, and had that entire force at his disposal, which would of left most of Europe at his feet.

Thank god he didn't, since the casualtys would be 10x worse if he had done something along those lines, and Death, is never good.

Remember, before someone tries to argue with me, i do NOT support Hitler, i am merely making an observance.

moritana
Post #155819 - Reply to (#155817) by Identity Crisis
user avatar
the(old)SRoMU boss
Member

7:12 pm, Apr 21 2008
Posts: 1501


Quote from thezombieking
For instance, if he had left Poland, France, and other countries on that side, alone, he could had killed Stalin, taken Russia, and had that entire force at his disposal, which would of left most of Europe at his feet.

killed stalin and took over russia? dude, even if he somehow, magically could have killed that guy with only his (very dumb) forces, it doesnt mean the whole country wouldve just obeyed him brainlessly. not to mention, he thought of the russians as one of the lower level races, aka for him- they were nothing but servants to the ari.
not to mention, that russia at the time was a bunch of villages around a bunch of cities. ppl lived their country side lives (until, of course, the goverment came and took them to war (my grandpa for example)).
from where did u get the idea that if hitler killed the not so very much liked leader, everyone would just follow him?

________________
the best security guard, EVER.
Deva
Post #155820 - Reply to (#155819) by moritana
user avatar
Member

7:20 pm, Apr 21 2008
Posts: 264


Quote from moritana
Quote from thezombieking
For instance, if he had left Poland, France, and other countries on that side, alone, he could had killed Stalin, taken Russia, and had that entire force at his disposal, which would of left most of Europe at his feet.

killed stalin and took over russia? dude, even if he somehow, magically could have killed that guy with only his (very dumb) forces, it doesnt mean the whole country wouldve just obeyed him brainlessly. not to mention, he thought of the russians as one of the lower level races, aka for him- they were nothing but servants to the ari.
not to mention, that russia at the time was a bunch of villages around a bunch of cities. ppl lived their country side lives (until, of course, the goverment came and took them to war (my grandpa for example)).
from where did u get the idea that if hitler killed the not so very much liked leader, everyone would just follow him?


Big parts of the Russian population welcomed the Wehrmacht as saviours,of course only until the killings began.

@thezombieking
And if he hadn't conquered Poland, France... he wouldn't have had the resources for his war.

Pages (4) [ 1 2 3 4 ] Next You must be registered to post!

Back to Chatter Box  Back to Top

Search This Topic:
 
Manga Search
MANGA Fu
MEMBERS
TEAM-BU


footer