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Post #787888 - Reply to (#787862) by Ergzay
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5:57 pm, Jan 1 2021
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Quote from Ergzay
It's not child pornography because there's no children involved. And pedophilia is a mental condition, not a content type. So you don't seem to understand the words you're using.


Uhh no I do actually. Shouta means little young boy in which case it would mean a child. You wouldn't call a grown man a little young boy now would you? Seems like you're the one who doesn't understand what Shouta means.

Post #787889 - Reply to (#787823) by zarlan
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5:59 pm, Jan 1 2021
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Quote from zarlan
Not making something illegal, means you support it?
Things we don't support, must be made illegal?
So I need to make all political views I don't agree with, illegal?
Wearing sweatpants outside, must be banned?
etc etc

I condemn loli/shota porn, and find it disgusting and disturbing.
…but a ...


What are you talking about? This isn't even about political views or even my own opinions. This is about child pornography and child pornography is illegal.


Post #787890 - Reply to (#787888) by redlinks
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7:24 pm, Jan 1 2021
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Quote from redlinks
You wouldn't call a grown man a little young boy now would you?

Well, if they're a midget or a manlet, yes, just to be nice to them. If they look rather mature, however, then you call them a dwarf.

Quote from redlinks
What are you talking about? This isn't even about political views or even my own opinions. This is about child pornography and child pornography is illegal.

Yes, cheeze pizza is illegal, however lolicon and shotacon material are not cheeze pizza. They're drawings. And, the fact that you want to ban drawings has everything to do with politics.

As numerous studies, and users in this thread, have verified, there has been zero connections found between porn (Even fictional porn) causing any amount of crime. If anything, they reduce the amount of crime, with the most "controversial" part being that they may provide an safe outlet for individuals who may pose the slightest amount of risk. So, the concept of banning porn would cause more harm than good when one steps back and thinks about it. That's what the studies show.

However, you then have puritans (On all side of the political spectrum) that then declare that the "Studies are incorrect, and 'common sense'' should declare otherwise". Well, in that case, let's use "common sense" to boil this down. First of all, the reason why you would want to ban these works is because they offend you on some level (Personally, morally, consciously, religiously, etc.). BUT, banning something because it offends you is not enough of a reason to cause people to be arrested over it. I find shows like Family Guy to be offensive (On a personal level, I find it to be of terrible quality, I don't take offense to the jokes), but that doesn't mean that I will (Nor that I should) lead a crusade against Fox and burn their studios to the ground over it.
Spoiler (mouse over to view)
And, in addition to that, I've heard several successful millionaires all repeating a very similar line: "If you're easily offended, don't go on the internet, don't get a job, don't get married, don't have kids, and don't be successful in life."

So, right there, we just established that using "common sense" dictates that "being offended" is not enough of a reason to ban content.

However, the "common sense" doesn't just end there. You may bring up that "common sense" indicates that you're jacking off to "children" because of one of many factors. First of all, there's the "language" used, and you would be surprised to know that "baby talk" actually is a fetish that loads of people have (Don't know why, it's not my thing and I don't plan to investigate). So, language isn't a determining factor. What about body size and development? Well, in that regard, declaring that the character has to be a "certain size" in order for it to not be "cheeze pizza" then brings you down the rabbit hole that all porn involving midgets and dwarves (Regardless of age) would have to be banned because it is "cheeze pizza". And, if you want to use "body development" as you're gauge, then you have the HILARIOUS law that already exists in Australia that declares that ANY porn using "flat-chested" models is automatically declared as child porn. So, using "common sense", size, body development, and language used cannot be trustworthy indicates of why you should ban lolicon and shotcan material. But what about the age of the character? Well, then you have instances such as 300 year old loli dragons in Fire Emblem: Awakening. You cannot pin anything down that will exclusively effect only lolicon and shotacon material. That's the conclusion that using "common sense" will lead down.

And, even IF you decide to eventually just give up and declaring that ALL drawings that can be deemed as "lewd" should be banned (Just as a way to kill a fruit fly with a rocket), then you end up becoming like Worst Korea, where the cops have LITERALLY HALTED all attempts to stop the production of REAL cheeze pizza because it's much easier to arrest a coffee shop owner and all her customers because someone was using the shop's wifi to read Stray Little Devil.

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Post #787891 - Reply to (#787890) by Transdude1996
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9:17 pm, Jan 1 2021
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Quote from Transdude1996
Well, if they're a midget or a manlet, yes, just to be nice to them. If they look rather mature, however, then you call them a dwarf.


Well that's not what the term means. In Japan, Shouta and lollicon refers to young children not dwarfs. If you actually read the history on the term, it began with a reference to a 10 year old boy Shotaro from Tetsujin 28. So Shota means little boys as in kids. If I were to show Himitsu no GyaruShota to a police officer, you're telling me that they wouldn't arrest me for having possession of child porn? I don't care if its drawings or real child porn. Possession of child porn of any kind is illegal. This is not my own opinion, it's fact no matter how much you try to defend it. You can go ahead and find shows like Family Guy offensive. I find child porn and even borderline child porn way more offensive than jokes said on Family Guy.

Post #787892 - Reply to (#787891) by redlinks
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9:53 pm, Jan 1 2021
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Quote from redlinks
Quote from Transdude1996
Well, if they're a midget or a manlet, yes, just to be nice to them. If they look rather mature, however, then you call them a dwarf.


Well that's not what the term means.

How autistic are you to miss the joke?

Quote from redlinks
If I were to show Himitsu no GyaruShota to a police officer, you're telling me that they wouldn't arrest me for having possession of child porn?

No, they wouldn't because (1) it's an underage boy being exploited (And, no one gives one single damn about underage boys being sexually exploited, just read up on how prepubescent male strippers and female pedophiles are treated), (2) it's a drawing so no judge is going to waste their time prosecuting it anyway, and (3) you didn't tell the officer about any of the real cheeze pizza that you stashed away (Which is how most of these current, illegal, laws are applied anyway, just as a way to increase the list of charges).

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Post #787893 - Reply to (#787891) by redlinks
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10:09 pm, Jan 1 2021
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Quote from redlinks
I find child porn and even borderline child porn way more offensive than jokes said on Family Guy.


Repeat after me: CESM INVOLVES REAL CHILDREN. NOT DRAWN LINES.

The content can be disgusting to you, and there's nothing wrong with that but for god's sake, CESM involves real children.

Quote from redlinks
Possession of child porn of any kind is illegal.


Yes, real children. Children who actually experience trauma and pain due to the actions that REAL PEOPLE make them go through when they're abused.

As someone has said, if you go to places like Toranoana and such in Japan, you will find that there are a lot of doujin that show underaged boys and girls, because those characters do not exist.


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Post #787894 - Reply to (#787892) by Transdude1996
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10:17 pm, Jan 1 2021
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Quote from Transdude1996
How autistic are you to miss the joke? No, they wouldn't because (1) it's an underage boy being exploited (And, no one gives one single damn about underage boys being sexually exploited, just read up on how prepubescent male strippers and female pedophiles are treated), (2) it's a drawing so no judge is going to waste their time prosecuting it anyway, and (3) you didn't tell the officer about any of the real cheeze pizza that you stashed away (Which is how most of these current, illegal, laws are applied anyway, just as a way to increase the list of charges).


Whatever. Go ahead and think you want you closet pedophile.

Post #787895 - Reply to (#787894) by redlinks
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10:31 pm, Jan 1 2021
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Quote from redlinks
Whatever. Go ahead and think you want you closet pedophile.

And, good day to you, too, you shota-thirsty Christmas cake.

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Post #787897 - Reply to (#787735) by Transdude1996
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6:14 am, Jan 2 2021
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omh stfu<3<3 why tf r bringing up social justice groups?? Huhhh?? lmao
ur username is literally "transdude1996"... cmon bro what

Last edited by sloez at 6:20 am, Jan 2

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Post #787898 - Reply to (#787894) by redlinks
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6:19 am, Jan 2 2021
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the fact theyre going so far to defend sexual shit with kids in it already tells u enough lol

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6:24 am, Jan 2 2021
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pretty sure there's broad laws against pornography 'where the actors appear to be below the age of majority'
the actual age is irrelevant to the greater social acceptability, for real people that are 19 but look 12 are ineligible for adult acting.

wonder why durrr

Post #787900 - Reply to (#787899) by Sugarshark
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6:51 am, Jan 2 2021
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I would really like to know more about this, do you have any source on it?

I'm not saying this to start an argument, since there's already one in this thread and all, but I would really like to know more since it piqued my curiosity and at first glance, all I could find was that -obviously- CESM is not allowed...

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Post #787901 - Reply to (#787900) by rokyun_
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7:31 am, Jan 2 2021
Posts: 373


Australia has laws to that effect. They attempted to expand upon that around a decade ago, as discussed in this thread.

Post #787902
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7:40 am, Jan 2 2021
Posts: 1786


@sloez
Coming in to insult both people after an argument is a pretty poor show, so how about you just stay on topic?


I do find it amusing that nobody of the pro ban people has addressed the problem with there being zero proof or even suggestion that the whole thing is harmful. Might as well go back to burning witches at that point. Or books. I heard both of these were highly successful in protecting people from harm.
Oh wait.

I'd rather ban all isekai cause that's obviously harmful to all those truck drivers that have to experience the emotional burden of having people die to their vehicles.
Hey we might actually have a chance with this one if we link it to suicide rates.

Last edited by Lorska at 7:59 am, Jan 2

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Post #787903 - Reply to (#787901) by hahhah42
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7:53 am, Jan 2 2021
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I'm a bit confused as to why this would be relevant as it's about videos and more importantly, actors. Which insinuates actual real breathing people doing stuff.

Isn't this completely unrelated to the completely fictional material of this discussion?

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