As the US continues to get even more involved with the middle east conflicts, more and more war crimes UN human rights violations by certain members of the US military personnel has been brought to light. In view of the recent tragedy that occurred at Afghanistan of 2010, nicknamed Kill Team, in which several US soldiers participated in the murdering and mutilation of innocent Afghanistan citizens. I cannot help but wonder what these events say about our military and our international agenda. What do you guys think?

Because I'm so upset right now when I saw that article and those pictures I just couldn't accept our military....did such things.....

Note the article of Kill Team from Rolling Stone contains several gruesome and gory pictures....

Last edited by BoxBox at 10:31 pm, Apr 11 2011

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Pretty much nothing new... we've been doing this sort of thing since... what, the time Hawaii was annexed? That's the first instance I can think of. The US has basically always acted this way... it often comes around to bite us in the ass, too. Iran (post-operation Ajax -> present) is a pretty great example.

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According to Wiki, the US war crime history dates back to Philippines 1899 to 1921 mostly involving torturing natives and concentration camps. The next in line was WW2, and then Vietnam War, following Yugoslavia, and the War of Terror.

I do believe there were more in the Korean War, as well as desert storm, and the Chinese revolution and civil war.

I think as citizens of a country that actually has the power to vote through democracy, we the people should inform others and hopefully allow more whistle blowing agency and more transparency within our government structure.

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I thought the US was into that business right from the start. But I guess it doesn't count unless it's recognised nation against nation. (It's only ethnic cleansing, when you slaughter undesirable people from your own country.)

And though I say it that way just to troll you, I know as well as the next man(/woman/entity) that world history is pretty much made of war crimes. There is no country I know of that isn't guilty in some way. But most stopped doing it before current times, of course.

I know....but it just angers me when our government, say the president, visits other countries and then criticize them for their human rights and war crimes. Do we have any moral leverage to complain about other countries anymore? It shames me to think that we proclaim ourselves the world police and most powerful and advanced nation in the world yet we are still responsible for so much suffering. I cannot accept the justification of "It's just war and everyone else do it too" therefore it's okay and let's sweep it under the rug.....

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It isn't that it's swept under the rug. The enough information's there to make a judgment. It's just that no one really cares all that much. At least, not enough to endanger the global economy, which tends to be the only factor with real influence these days.

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NightSwan also said that she wanted to peg me, once, but I'm not sure whether to take that as a compliment or a threat...

I think you misunderstood me. I did not mean all things are okay just because everyone used to do it when they were young and stupid. I just mean that, it's not a black and white issue. Both sides are usually at some kind of fault, and even the indignant bystanders are usually somewhat grey, at least if you look far back enough.

Edit: Well, that said, I think the US foreign policy has been a disaster for as long as the country has existed. As for nowadays... World police? Not bloody likely. Police are supposed to uphold the laws.

Last edited by pnyxtr at 5:23 pm, Apr 15 2011

another abu ghraib

woa! woa! - hold on here, first of all incidents like this should in no way characterize service members of the US armed forces as a whole

i am a commissioned member of the US armed forces who attended a federal service academy. i've also seen first hand how governments in other developed nations such as in China, South America, and the EU behave and i can guarantee you that the "Kill Team" is not the norm

the majority of service members in the armed forces of the USA are comprised of people like myself who honestly strive to bring positive change to our own country and the world at large, the judicial system within our military bureaucracy is also one designed to punish perpetrators of hate and war crimes - that said i admit it's not a perfect system, but policing of military service is an ongoing project for improvement that will not happen overnight

let's face it - there are really sick twisted evil people in the world, they perpetrate an attitude against education and pro ignorance, combine this with a VOLUNTEER military fighting force trained in the art of war and under the worst circumstances war crimes do happen - it's unfortunate but in the US fighting force this happens more when the whole chain of command system fails, it is not the norm (just look at all the schools we've been building in Afghanistan and the fact that our taxpayers have invested trillions in rebuilding infrastructure of the middle east)


don't single out the USA military when incidents like this happen with NATO forces, we're not perfect, and you really don't want to even know what the armies of some S.A. nations, China and the far east communist block do to their own people, (who aren't enemies of the state) - just look at what's happening in the Middle East right now (do you honestly believe Liberia's armies are a better alternative to U.S. and Coalition forces?)

Your damn right. The worst part is, is that now every good deed that the soldiers have done is erased in the minds of people, because of what a group of psychotic cruel murderers decided to do. What they did is wrong, but in no way does this impact how anyone should(I said should because enivitibly, it will anyway) view our soldiers. How is it that everytime a story like this appears everyone is ready to attack the actions of the perpetrators, not wrongly mind you, but when a school is built or hospitals opened, nobody here wants to start a thread on that.

It was horrible what happened, but this does not say anything about the U.S. What this says is that even in the U.S. there are sick racist people who feel the need to kill innocents.

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this just from my point of view as non american.

@APOKOLYPES: I totally agree, scum are everywhere.

regardless I still prefer that US is the current super power in the world than any other nation, it could be lot worse, If it were another nation like north korea, they might just cover it up.

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Personally, I would absolutely not single out the military as a collective. Instead, I would like to point out that it's a completely fucking insane political decision to send volunteer boys who have little experience of life whatsoever to first fight a war almost halfway around the globe (when few of them have ever even been out of their state before, let alone the country) and then expect them to keep the peace there afterwards. It's a small wonder that not more of them snap.

But APOKOLYPES, you seriously don't do yourself any favours when you compare the US armed services to those of some rather nasty totalitarian states. Saying that you're better than the very worst doesn't really work, you should be among the best instead. (I'm not saying the situation in the US military is one way or the other, I'm just saying that particular comparison is bad, don't fall in that trap.)

well fortunately for me and you we live in a society where we have the right to complain and more than that, in our country: >>>>>>>>>if you really don't like something the government does so much, you can go and change it<<<<<<<<


you right...

i should avoid looking hypocritical...

-_- look, i'm not looking to do myself any favors, i'm actually trying to do you a favor by teaching you that it is downright rude and ignorant for you to lump together the sum off all U.S. foreign policy and mentality of our service members, you remind me of Alkaid and how they conveniently forget Kosovo (or the fact that there are plenty of ethnic Muslims in the U.S. armed forces) when they&also you accuse American of genocide

you'd be amazed what some of us have accomplished in our short lives...

like i tried to convey earlier - the Government & Administrative systems of the U.S.A. are not perfect, and it's true that special interest can and at times has historically gained footing ("duoy" it's what happens when you have a government that goes and lets people exercise their opinions/democracy), but most of us both abroad and locally are trying to work for the greater good

And you'll be surprised how much you'll agree with me when you're twice your current age.

Maybe I should have made it more clear that I have no beef whatsoever with the army or with people in the service. Or I wouldn't be working in the defence industry, after all. (And just so you know, I used to be what amounts to an E-6 myself, but my whole batallion got scrapped once the USSR had been dead for enough years. Yay for that!) Personally, I think it's likely that you're doing a lot more good than harm. But the thread was originally about what I consider momentary lapses of reason/morals/sanity from people who were placed in situations they really weren't equipped for.

And as for that, I find that quite a lot of the responsibility rests with the people who make the top-level decisions. And I also find that quite a few of those decisions have been very foolish, for a long time.

Haven't you ever wondered why so many people in the world are pissed at the US, for instance? They didn't just start to think like that out of spite, or envy. Well, maybe the French are envious, but that's to be expected, and the worst they can do is hit you with a baguette

Though, I was in Egypt a couple of weeks ago, and as you no doubt know they kicked a US-backed dictatorship out recently. What surprised me is that pretty much everyone I met was still pro-US. It's never as simple as one might think...

As for your rant about me being rude and ignorant, sure, I can be both, at the drop of a hat. But not for the reason you stated. Come on, man, I did especially differentiate between people in the service and their political leaders.

I think the US government generally goes by the rule "if it's not convinient for us (the government), it simply doesn't exist"; and it's not just the US government that's like that.

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