Why are people using the 'Relationship' categories for non-romance?
2 years ago
Posts: 137
Do people use the 'Relationship' categories for non-romance interactions?
I read the 'Relationship' categories as being 'in a relationship with', so when a wholesome child raising story with a "Father-Daughter Relationship" category it makes me worry that there is going to be an Usagi Drop type plot development
(The 'father' raises a non-blood related girl for years then gets into a romantic relationship with her)
EX
Student-Student Relationship -> "The student is in a relationship with another student"
Student-Teacher Relationship -> "The student is in a relationship with a teacher"
God-Human Relationship -> The God is in a relationship with a human"
Brother-Sister Relationship -> "The boy is in a relationship with his sister." (This sentence sounds like incest)
Father-Daughter Relationship -> "The father is in a relationship with his daughter" (This sentence also sounds like incest)
*edited to add clarity and examples
2 years ago
Posts: 31
That isn't what I think of when I think of the word relationship. The term "Father daughter relationship" is used all the time without incestous tones, the term God human relationship is the relationship between human and (a) god without romantic overtones. Even the term brother sister relationship doesn't necessarily mean anything romantic. Relationship is simply like a bond, sometimes it can mean romantic love(as in we're "IN" a relationship) but you can also say we have a good brother sister relationship(which doesn't mean anything romantic), or yes I have a good mother-son relationship(it's more natural to say I have a good relationship with my brother/mother though).
By a tag I think it simply means an existence of something, it's hard to explain but a tag like father-daughter relation doesn't scream romantic to me, nor does God-human, but because of the prevalence of the term brother-sister relationship does suggest something more romantic to me, though once again, the term relationship can be vague as a descriptor.

2 years ago
Posts: 205
For the most part, I think it's appropriate to use the Relationship tag for non-romantic relationships. Some people are looking for stories that reflect on various types of non-romantic relationships as well and there are manga that do this (they may have a side romantic plot unrelated to that). Some tags I inherently see with a "this is likely romantic" - such as Student-Teacher, but I don't see familial relationship tags as inherently like that without a clear indicator (Hentai, Ecchi, Adult).
I do see your point though on why there should be a very clear distinction since some people really do not want to see some content and others looking for more taboo romance don't want to sit through 40+ chapters of serious relationship analysis and no kink. This is more a problem of a lack of tagging guidelines. I've gone through a few manga where there are important non-romantic relationships and here are the tags I'm seeing consistently:
- Important Non-Romantic Relationship/s
- Father and Daughter
- Child/ren
- Childcare
- Mother and Daughter
There are very few, from what I am seeing, that use the "Relationship" tag though. So people are, for the most part, using that for romantic relationships rather than platonic (probably because the more taboo ones are popular in shojo like Student-Teacher and others like incest are popular Hentai plots), but some are probably slipping through the cracks.
http://i.imgur.com/LxhWm.jpg (will reformat this some day…)
2 years ago
Posts: 137
I also use the term in a non-romantic way in real life, this was more how I normally see it used in Categories on MU. In the past I only saw it used on romantic interactions.
My concern is that if we are using those categories for any type of relationship they become useless. Almost every single 'School Life' story will then have the "Student-Student Relationship" and many will also have "Student-Teacher Relationship". Any story with god/human interactions would have 'God-Human Relationship' which would make categories like 'God/s' mostly redundant
From your example I would use Categories like "Brother and Sister", "Father and Daughter", Brother/s, Sister/s, Family, "Loving Family", etc
@ flowinmyboat my thoughts were along the same lines as you in that since most of the 'x - x Relationship' tags are romantic, to be consistent all of them should be considered so.

2 years ago
Posts: 205
I agree with you. Not sure what the solution would be. I am not a fan of fast and loose tagging, so I don't think every "School Life" manga should have the "Student-Student Relationship" tag unless them being students is relevant or notable in some regard rather than a state of being (e.g., a student council president dates an unpopular student and the school or school setting directly relates to their romance; essentially, their student status is core to their dynamic.) Relationship doesn't just mean interactions to me. It means the identities in that Relationship tag are important to how the characters interact and engaged with each other.
http://i.imgur.com/LxhWm.jpg (will reformat this some day…)

2 years ago
Posts: 62
How about changing word "relationship" to "romance"? No more misunderstandings 👌
2 years ago
Posts: 137
That wouldn't be ideal because sometimes the relationships are just friends with benefits, PWP, nonc*n etc.
--> I used 'non-romance' as a catchall to keep the topic title SFW
If we were going to change it then 'pairing' would be the closest term I think

2 years ago
Posts: 62
Vote for two: "A-B Couple" and "A-B Friendship"
Or: "A-B Romantic Relationship" and "A-B Nonromactic Relationship"
2 years ago
Posts: 80
I agree with your solution: it clarifies everything and it avoids misunderstandings.
2 years ago
Posts: 137
A-B Couple/Pairing/Intimacy/Relationship
A-B Friendship
I would suggest the above since often the more taboo pairings are not romantic (think hentai and ecchi). Some people might misunderstand and use the non-romantic for 'friends with benefits'/arranged marriage/n*ncon etc
Alternate option is we can leave the original as is (and assume it is romantic/intimate in nature) and make new tags for "A-B Friendship/Non-Romantic"
Another option is to change the wording on the original tags to be "A-B in a Relationship"

1 year ago
Posts: 62
Omg if there will be split, i hope nobody will tag noncon/hentai with same tag for romance couples, we don't have exclude tag option yet :/.
I know I used "friendship" in previous message but I didn't think this through enough... for example "father and daughter " doesn't fit in it, it's family bound. But still word relationship is too ambiguous to use it.
My new idea for first type: A-B love relationship
(Maybe we end with three types? XD love, family/friend and bad relations?)
1 year ago
Posts: 463
"A-B Relationship", as a tag, would generally imply a romantic and/or sexual relationship.
Particularly as there is little point. in having a tag for it, if it's a non-romantic/sexual relationships, in most cases.
As has been states, having a "Student-Student Relationship" and "Student-Teacher Relationship" tag, on every single series that involves a school (as they all involve students who have fellow students, as well as students being taught by teachers), is completely redundant, unnecessary, and utterly pointless.
As that is the case, the vast majority of people would assume that the tag indicates romantic/sexual relations, as it wouldn't make sense for it to mean anything else.
The same is true of "Father-daughter relationship".
Sure, that phrase may be mostly used in a non-romantic/sexual way, in regular speech/writing, but in the context of it being a tag, I'd say that it would be rather obvious, that it means a romantic/sexual relation.
There is no point in saying "relationship", otherwise.
Also, what would be the point of "A-B Friendship" tags? What need is there, for any such tags?
Still, some may misunderstand, in the case of the family-relationship-tags, so I can understand wanting to change their name, to be clearer, could be good, but...
Changing "relationship" to "romance", would be wrong, as the tags don't necessarily indicate romantic relationships. It could be a purely sexual relationship ...or a relationship that has all the hallmarks of being girlfriend/boyfriend, but without any romantic feelings ...or a non-consensual relationship.
Also, "couple" indicates (and "pairing" explicitly states), that it's two people who are with each other and no one else, which isn't always true (harems, cheating, open relationships...), intimacy is too broad... (family relations are, or at least should be, intimate. As are close friendships)
I don't really see a good alternative.
As for the distinctions of the different types of relations/feelings, setting aside the issue of tags and tag names:
Love covers a lot more than just romantic love.
Family relationships involve love ...or at least they are supposed to. (you can have an absence of love, in deeply dysfunctional family relationships, and any family relationships involving psychopaths and the like)
Also, really good and close platonic friendships, involve love.
(please note, that friendship and romantic relations, aren't mutually exclusive categories: You can have friendship without romance, romance without friendship ...or romance including friendship. Couples that have both, are far more likely to last)
Also, you can have couples/pairings or the similar relationships, that don't involve romantic love:
Purely sexual relationships (either where they are bound by lust, rather than love ...or the person is convenient, rather than someone they are especially attracted to ...or they have sex with just about anyone), sham relationships...
Arranged marriages, where the people involved don't really know each other...
And you very often have people who start dating, without any love being involved, as dating is often about finding someone to love (trying out various people, by dating them), rather than getting together with the one you are already in love with, after all.
(also, you can have a couple that love each other, but where that love is non-romantic)
And then you also have relationships (especially in hentai, no doubt [which I assume has the most egregious examples, by a wide margin] ...but also plenty in non-hentai, including works with minors as a target demographic) where one, or both, are not really freely consenting...
Problematic and unhealthy.