when faniction or dj is created, the people (fans) are accused of creating "mary sue" the perfect portrayal of the ideal characters. the "wish come true" dream of situations.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Sue

says that mary sue are:
The term is also associated with cliché such as exotic hair and eye colors, mystical or superhuman powers, exotic pets, possessions, or origins, or an unusually tragic past, especially when these things are glaringly out of step with the consistency of the canon. These features are commonplace in "Mary Sues", though even a character who lacks them may be labeled a "Sue" by some critics. Even in canon where such qualities are the norm, an original female character who has them still runs the risk of being labeled a "Sue". The term is more broadly associated with characters who are exceptionally and improbably lucky. The good luck may involve romance ("Mary Sue" always gets her man); adventure ("Mary Sue" always wins a fight or knows how to solve the puzzle) and popularity (the "right people" seem to gravitate towards the character). These characters have few problems while attempting to achieve their goals. "Everything goes her way" is a common criticism regarding "Mary Sues", the implication being that the character's inability to fail makes her insufficiently humanized or challenged to be interesting or sympathetic.

but...doesn't this go for many of actual shojo characters?
so what's the point of labeling "mary sue" when most shojo characters are this way 😕

ex.
sakura from tsubasa chronicle: tragic past, awsome hidden power, unbelievable lucky-ness
special a- total child prodigy
peauty pop - another child prodigy
saskue from naruto - awsome power since birth, tragic history
naruto from naruto - same as above
ichigo from bleach - power-pumped, some amazing luck
orihime from bleach - tragic past, incredibly beautiful, and or some reason, pro healing machine
hitsugaya from bleach - child prodigy
alice from pandora heart - tragic past, awsome power
otohime from one piece - tragic end, awsome personality,
robin from one piece - tragic past, awsome power

list goes on

it's hard NOT to find a mary sue. if someone isn't maey sue, they are usualy background character noone cares about.
so why so many rage from creating "mary sue"?

why not
read the litmust test and the criticism part of the wiki link you yourself posted

picard is a sue
kirk is a sue
guts is a sue
luffy is a sue
naruto is a sue
superman is one
wolverine is one
and another million characters would fit

ppl just like to label things
some are overbearing sues like weasly crusher in TNG
they are the problem

Because if it's something like the main character from 100% perfect girl then it becomes a problem. Every guy falls in love with her, some at first sight. They attempt to pretty much rape her, but she's fine with that. She understand them all so well. Unrealistic

Anyways people can't always be winning unless they are, THE best, not some little kid with some power and is really arrogant. What's really annoying about this is, the author decides that they need some new power, or realizes, that they are a complete power house, the practically invincible main character loses a fight and goes through some training arc that lasts like 1/4th the series.

Main character luck is also pretty annoying too.

Hey, I actually like the idea of "Mary Sue" after all most of the popular mangas incorporates this idea and thats what makes them popular!
And seriously, no one would want to read a story about a crying/needy/weak/stupid female or male lead if they can be superpowerful/hot/sexy etc.

Just my opinion lol

well, because mary sues are supposed to be 'perfect' and therefore boring, mary sues always get the guy, or they're always nice or they have something 'special' (like, exotic eyes or something) that endears the other characters to them. To me mary sues have a lack of character just like weak crying shoujo heroines and i'd rather read about someone who isn't perfect and could be a real person(unlike mary sues and the crying shoujo heroines) than reading about some boring perfect god/ess whose only problem is getting the guy or whatever. theres no substance in plots starring mary sues and if i wanted to just look at pretty pictures i'd go to an art museum.

edit: to me, having a tragic past doesnt make a character automatically a mary sue. i mean, i guess nightwing is supposed to be perfect, but he has the character to go along with the tragic past(i think? i havent really read it) and he's got imperfections(womanizing, cocky) so, if he were a real person it would work.

[img][/img] A senpai tried to violate me after hearing about my transfer. BUT I RAPED HIM INSTEAD.

oh so ur saying that even is a character is totally over powered, if they have bad or cold persoality than they are not counted as mary sue?

if there is at least ONE flaw in their character, than its ok??

One or two Sue traits does not make a character a Mary Sue. It's when a character has an excess of Sue traits that it becomes a problem. The Mary Sue Litmus Test explains it best:

"Please, please, please remember that these are the symptoms, not the disease. I am not implying that each of these traits is inherently bad and should be avoided at all costs. Think of them as being like salt or spices - they serve to enhance the dish when used in the right amounts, but when used too liberally, the result tends to be quite unappetizing."

http://www.springhole.net/quizzes/marysue.htm

Try taking the test - you'll get a better idea of what a Mary Sue is.

Aren't Mary Sue characters meant to be based off the author? Kind of like how they wish they were, or how they wish their life would have turned out. "Perfect" character ≠ Mary Sue. That's what I was told ages ago anyway, and it's what I think of when I hear the term.

In any case, Mary Sue characters aren't that big of a deal. If it's a badly written character then the story will be crap and boring anyway, regardless of how you label said character. I think Mary Sue is a label that gets thrown around so much that it's just ridiculous now, and should be ignored.

[img]http://i370.photobucket.com/albums/oo143/TurboPhoenix/FireflySig.jpg[/img]

Quote from Blique

One or two Sue traits does not make a character a Mary Sue. It's when a character has an excess of Sue traits that it becomes a problem. The Mary Sue Litmus Test explains it best:

"Please, please, please remember that these are the symptoms, not the disease. I am not implying that each of these traits is inherently bad and should be avoided at all costs. Think of them as being like salt or spices - they serve to enhance the dish when used in the right amounts, but when used too liberally, the result tends to be quite unappetizing."

http://www.springhole.net/quizzes/marysue.htm

Try taking the test - you'll get a better idea of what a Mary Sue is.

thx for the link
i just did a part 1 of ot on some character
sasuke from naruto - 39
naruto from naruto - 60
ichigo from bleach - i didnt do it but based on these questions he is a definite mary sue
lacus from gunda seed - OMG

i think either the questions are flawed, or majority of the characters in popular mangas ARE mary sue
i mean, if you're writing an adventure or romance manga or whatever, the main character need to be different and special. otherwise there just isn't enough material to make an interesting plot.
who want to read about a just average ordinary girl with nothing special? don't you that hundreds of times a day in school? what's the point of making a story of something that we experience in daily basis?

Quote from Hespia Klarerin

who want to read about a just average ordinary girl with nothing special? don't you that hundreds of times a day in school? what's the point of making a story of something that we experience in daily basis?

Well, there is such a thing as the slice of life genre.

Yeah, but I guess sometimes a perfect character can make the story interesting.. Like progressing the plot in a way that it shows the flaw of the Mary Sue as that she has no flaw. Not that I've seen that in any manga yet! 🤣 But yeah, when a mangaka doesn't use his/her/their Mary Sue in that way, it's really boring and annoying D:

just a general question for you

do you find that

lacus clyne from gundam seed
kira yamato from gundam seed
L from death note
Light yagamai from death note
ichogo from bleach
orihime from bleach
hitsugaya from bleach
naruto from naruto
sasuke from naruto
sakura from tsubasa chronicle
Robin from one piece
Ace from one piece
superman
wolverine

are all mary sue?
in honest opinions, are they mary sue in your point of view?
why not?
because according to above survey, they are.

Characters like Sakura (TRC), Sasuke, and Naruto (Naruto) are kinda sorta "Mary Sue"s depending on how you view them. But I might disagree on L... I think that L was the first archetype for that kind of "Mary Sue," so that doesn't make L exactly the Mary Sue...? 😕 But I definitely don't think that survey is exactly right. That survey is made for general/overall characters from all possible media, but we're talking about the Japanese community specifically here. Japanese and American "Mary Sue"s are pretty different. [E.g. The typical American female protagonist is strong willed and strong whereas the typical Japanese female protagonist is girly and moe.] What's considered a Mary Sue in America can be considered original in Japan and vice versa. I took an OC of mine that I thought was definitely a Mary Sue and took the quiz and I got a 6... orz

Yes, I find most of those characters you listed to be Mary Sues (why would you think Superman isn't one?). I also disagree about L, and according to the survey, he's not a Mary Sue. I guess the survey depends a fair bit on the opinions of the person taking it as well.

Anyway, just because a character is popular doesn't mean he/she is not a Mary Sue. Mary Sues often have traits that were made cool by a popular story, but have been overused by wannabes. As the survey says, there are some people who can pull off a Mary Sue and make it work. Thus, there's no point in citing characters from popular series (with authors that are likely geniuses), declaring them Mary Sues, and expecting backlash.

I also recommend adopting a tone that doesn't sound like you're picking a fight, as it's taking a fair amount of effort to not reciprocate.

mary sue is just another label... if fans find a character who is favored by the author or other fans and seems 'annoying', they'll immediately accuse that character of being a mary sue... it's just a matter of perspective
though I think it's more often used to refer to a character with half-assed development, hence why it's mostly used as a criticism towards the author.... that's why many wouldn't agree that the characters listed above are 'Mary Sues' - I mean, yes some parts of them might be stereotypical, but the execution of their characters is neat enough that more people think of them as cool/awesome rather than wtf/annoying