I admit it - I'm a bit of a fujoshi. Shonen-ai is one of my favorite genres because of the forbidden-love dynamic, the clashing against culture and the melodrama that comes with fighting against feelings. (And for the bishonens x 2.) My gripe against it, though, is that these things are really mostly nonexistent in shonen-ai manga. They all seem to take place in a magical world where every guy is incredibly beautiful, nobody cares whether it's a guy or a girl you fall in love with as long as he's cute, and homophobia (and the female population) doesn't exist. And then there's the uke/seme dynamic. So every guy is either a giant macho rapist or a girl with male organs. It ends up just being futanari sans breasts. Do the mangakas realize that gay people really exist and aren't just some fantasy for girls?

(Not that there aren't some great series that have the uke/seme dynamic, and not that people that read those are idiots. I read a like a lot of them myself, but I would like to find something different.)

So I'm wondering if anyone could suggest a shonen-ai that isn't like that. Yaoi is also accepted as long as it has some sort of storyline, although I bet it would be even harder to find a yaoi that didn't fit the cliches. 🙄

Moved to Yaoi/Yuri forum~

The Tyrant Who Falls in Love is my first thought. Great story.

Kyuuso wa Cheese no Yumewomiru should work too. I haven't read the sequel yet, but it appears to follow the same way.

If you don't mind supernatural fantasy, Crimson Spell is pretty good too, though you don't get the "real life" feel since it's a fantasy.

You might want to check out this thread - though there is a lot to sift through.

There's also this thread.

If you've ever thought or said "Nice Guys finish last" and really meant it, then you should probably read this LJ post by DivaLion. It's incredibly insightful whether you're male or female.

From a bumper sticker I like:
"If you're gonna ride my ass, at least pull my hair."

probably Koi no Kawaki; never read any yaoi like it.if i'm basing it on the plot.

Quote from Yenoh

probably Koi no Kawaki; never read any yaoi like it.if i'm basing it on the plot.

Seconded.

For that matter, there aren't that many yaoi marked as "psychological", and those are often favorites of mine because they're unconventional. I'd go through that list.

If you've ever thought or said "Nice Guys finish last" and really meant it, then you should probably read this LJ post by DivaLion. It's incredibly insightful whether you're male or female.

From a bumper sticker I like:
"If you're gonna ride my ass, at least pull my hair."

There are reasons for the cliches and mangakas don't create yaoi for gay people.

Search on this forum and you will find a few threads of our previous discussion on this topic.

You could check these: 1, 2, 3, 4.

You might like Turning Point (TAKANAGA Hinako) too if you are after stories close to realistic gay relationships. I also recommend Running on Empty as a good shounen-ai.

If you want forbidden-love dynamic, the clashing against culture and the melodrama that comes with fighting against feelings, Jazz is one I can remember now.

I don't think Crimson Spell is the type you are after though.

Hmmm...

I dunno, maybe some of the titles by Miyamoto Kano?

Mmm... I can't think of any standard BL manga to recommend, apart from Kaze to ki no uta.

And let's see:

Mirai no Kioku and its' sequel: Future lovers 2

About Koisoru Boukun, let me warn that there is far more sex than plot or character development and the development keeps running backwards and stonewalling. It's pretty sad when authors give up good writing, to cater to the masses. But I'd recommend some of the titles by that author though. Little Butterfly is pretty awesome and so is Challengers.

Sono Kuchibiru ni Yoru no Tsuyu ... hmm, has a fair amount of characterisation and development. Be warned though: it contains rape.

Homerun Ken(I'm sure you know about her) does a fair mixture of shounen-ai and yaoi. Kiki was quite good. 😛

And now I'll recommend some stuff which has a fair amount of development and plot:
Mitsuyaku
Tsukigasa
Yume Musubi, Koi Musubi

Jaryuu Dokuro has some pretty good series.
Yamada Yugi: I'd recommend Isshou Tsuzukerarenai Shigoto and Yume wo Miru Hima mo Nai for now.

Chi-Ran is one of the few manga authors who can understand what psychology really is and not just sprout some theories or half-assed ideas that don't make any sense.

If you're into hardcore s&m, Hoshi no Yakata would be a good match with good plot.

Hmmm... I'd list more but meh, this is more than enough for now.

If you want BL manga, written by men... errr... lol. Well, let me state a few male names instead but be warned that some of these authors, their manga isn't very plot-worthy but sex-centric instead.

Kujou Aoi
Kisaragi Hirotaka
Takatsuki Noboru
Takao Hiroi or basically, the other guy he collaborates with.

As for gay manga, I think that'd be in another area... ever heard of bara? If not, better don't look for it. 😛

@base_coat: Hmmm... well I'll just comment that a lot of gay men even liked Haru wo Daite Ita and that yaoi manga is also sold in the gay bookshops of Nii-chome? Or whatever that place is called? And hmmm... it seems that some of the BL publishers are starting to cater for gay men: by having magazines featuring content created by gay men. But otherwise, you might just be right.

Lucky-kun by Takaguchi Satosumi

I like the fact that they don't just jump into the relationship, and struggle with accepting their feelings.

Ever tried any Kusama Sakae? I think that her mangas has a bit of maturity. She's one of my favorites, sadly, not many of her work are scanlated.

Some selected works of MOTONI Modoru, maybe. She's got some very odd works.

@yuri21
Not just Haru wo Daite Ita, they might even like TAKANAGA Hinako's or Yamada Yugi's works since different readers have different tastes. But that doesn't mean those yaoi titles are especially created for them. Some can even have the rape/dominating/possessive seme fetish that's prevalent in shoujo and yaoi. Who knows? It's a fetish. I am 100% sure.

Have a look at those shotacon yaoi hentai (though not many have been translated) - they are created for men, no matter what their sexuality is. 🤣 But that doesn't mean they don't have women readers or fans.

For unconventional BL author, KYUUSHUU Danji is one but you can't find melodrama, clashing with homophobia and such, which seem to be what akari_mizunashi likes, in them. Their works are like gag comedies and some of them are overflown with yaoi cliches but not in the usual way they are used. In short, those are not supposed to be taken seriously and supposed to be funny. I personally don't find them funny but odd. However, some people do find them funny.

@base_coat:

The thing is that, if such manga continues to sell and to be sold at , then it must mean that they're following a certain marketing strategy, no? Like carrying a certain manga which features <certain type of plot, people with a certain personality/body build/etc.>. But at the same time, if they sell enough, these "elements" are likely taken into account at the publishing office and then somewhat reflected in a certain mangaka's work. Like the editor will tell the mangaka "let's do a scene/story <that has this, this, and that>". And I'm quite sure that they do discuss about it.

Also, as to whether yaoi manga is created only for women, well... the creators may say so but what really happens between the editor(s) and creator and also within the publishing office: only those involved would know? I'm referring specifically to those "layers" and "inner and outer" truths that run within Japanese society. Like a certain BL mangaka may tell outsiders that "my work is created for only women" but within their group, everyone knows that it's created and marketed for not just women but at certain gay men too. They just don't always tell the entire truth, to create an illusion that adheres to society's expectations and norms.

Fetish or not? Hmmm... I've no comments on that, since I believe what is a kink/fetish for someone might well be thoughts/feelings for others or even something that happened in reality, for someone.

Quote from yuri21

Also, as to whether yaoi manga is created only for women, well...

Fetish or not? Hmmm... I've no comments on that, since I believe what is a kink/fetish for someone might well be thoughts/feelings for others or even something that happened in reality, for someone

It's you who mentioned only. 😉

Of course a fetish is a though/feelings. Whether they it happens in reality is irrelevant to the fact that it is fetishized. But I don't think such happens often in reality is because humans are selfish. Of course they fantasize about someone going out of their way to "love" unconditionally. 🤣 It's the ultimate nature and repetitive theme of most shoujo and yaoi smut no matter how poorly or oddly executed the story is. If it sells, it will be reproduced. Is it the emotional and needy who like to read such? I don't know, I really don't. Maybe you can provide some thought.

I believe the glasses teacher from Hoozuki no Shima shows more of the truth of sexual violence. It's uncomfortable to read this manga, but I think it depicts dark sides of human nature very well, though that's probably not the main theme or point of the story.

Wow, thanks for all the suggestions, they all look great! ^^ Reading over my thread post I didn't think I'd get any because of how bitchy I sounded. Well, I do have an HBI card membership.

For the record, I'm actually a straight girl, and I like a fair amount of fetishy unrealistic manga. But as with any genre, I'm always looking for the creme de la creme.

Also, I really don't like bara. =\ I wandered into it looking for some gay romance without the uke/seme dynamic... and ran out screaming. (-.-) Porn written by men is porn written by men no matter who's involved.

I whole heartedly suggest Totally Captivated unless you haven't already read it.

One of my favorite BL authors would have to be Setona Mizushiro. You should check out her works if you haven't. They're always different, but in a good way.

[img]http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d25/khmershinobi/b750d351697e8dd4b2600bce2a15e1e9-2-2.jpg[/img]

__ I'll have what she's having... please~♥