Thank you, I'm quite flattered that you would see me as an intellectual. Although compared to the people that I hang out with I feel like such a novice. What I'm agreeing with you is on the fact that you can make scripture say anything you want. Whether or not it is true is a matter of looking at what evidence you have to back up your claims. The Bible isn't a book for the ignorant, if you want to read it, you have to get ready to really analyze and read critically. I used to read the Qu'ran alot and one of the things this particular book does in order to deter people from looking at the Bible, is to take bits and pieces of scripture, tear away the context and make the bible say something that backs up the Qu'ran. The Qu'ran is very clear that Jesus never claimed to be God, and it cites quotes by Jesus to affirm this view. If you look at the words Jesus says in the Bible, you'll find that the Qu'ran is absolutely right, Jesus did say those things. What the Qu'ran doesn't tell you is this was one sentence in a long speech that was making the point that he was God.

One thing I enjoy about the atheist outlook is that you can see things objectively and are not going to believe simply because your told to. Atheist love to question and figure things out and I think God really appreciates this outlook as well, because God wants your full trust, not your blind obedience. He gave you the ability to think and he expects you to use it.

What I'm questioning is why do you choose to believe in God even though the Bible contradicts itself, and its clearly the works of primative men. I won't requote myself because you can easily read what I wrote again. Its not only the scripture that pains me, its also the believers who destroy science and attack everyone (Protestants fighting with Catholics). Its clear that without these religious fanatics we would probably be living better due to advaces in science by stem cell research and other "unethical" practices. Why is it that there were miracles before when the bible was written, and now we have no more miracles? I used to be a blind believer, then when I read the bible I asked myself, "Doesn't this sound ridiculous ?" Instead of brilliance, much of the Bible contained nonsense.

Loli, the reason I believe is because God came into my life and gave me a reason to investigate the claims made in the bible. If you want I can PM you my testimony if you want the details behind how he actually came into my life. In terms of the bible being written by primitive man, I'm in complete agreement. The Bible has about 40 different authors and spans over 1500 years. I don't know the Old testament well enough to give you a satisfying explanation of the versus you listed as contradictions. But what I did not notice while reading through it, is (no offense intended here) a far too simple analysis. It's all about context once again. You as an atheist should know better than to just read and accept. You must question the text. Why is the text discriminating certain people here, is God advocating discrimination if so where else in the bible does this show up, or why is it that this text is advocating killing when the 10 commandments say don't murder? These are the kind of questions that will help you to understand the bible and God. My recommendation is to get in a pretty high level Bible study and ask these kinds of questions to the people leading them. i don't defend sin, even if it is commited by people that claim to be waving the banner of Jesus Christ. We are all sinners, and that includes Christians. Science is a great tool for us humans to help each other and to understand the universe that we live in. It is through the study of the latter that we can put the claims of not only the bible but other religion's beliefs to the test.

I went to a catholic school




I was expelled after 3 months

LOL. hahahah what'd you do? ;]

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-Max

@loli
i agree with what you said but one point really RALLY ticks me off.
PLEASE dont bring the issue of the bible into your fight with zubz over belief.
sure it was written by primitive ppl, it was a FEW THOUSANDS YEARS AGO!!!!!
the bible is not a collection of complete nonsense, its a colection of several history books, that unfortunately were written by a bunch of idiots that misunderstood what they saw.
screen the nonsential idiotizm about "god told me so" and the miracles, and you get a legitimate history book.

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the best security guard, EVER.

Hmmmmm.
I was expecting a flame trail a mile wide but have only been quoted twice!

DeLtA_ljK : the only one who has read "The God Delusion", except me? Sad, if true
loli : nice posts, I'm looking forward to the duel 't'ween you and Zubz313!
Vinceasuma: keep it up, just the right side of downright nasty
totalanime: you rock, too

OK, here's the spark for the flame trails:

1. Have you noticed that all atheists have actually READ the bible (and are unconvinced, to say the least), whereas ALL theists have NOT read any science (yeah, flame-on!);
2. Christians, Jews and Muslims worship the SAME god.
3. Christians:, your guy was a JEW! (So quit the anti-semitism.)
4. Moslems: your guy was a CHRISTIAN! (So quit the whatever-is-going -on-now crap.)


Oh, and Zubz313 is a citizen of Crete!

AHAHA!! I have appeared once again! I knew this topic will live on forever. Now, don't flame in the name of religion. That has already been done on a large scale during the Holy War.


and Conquestor was expelled for practicing Satanism.

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Gay book discussion thread

I find this thread to be so funny.
It was merely suppose to ask people if they believed in God.
Now there are arguments over the belief.

@Loli

You need to realize the the whole Bible is required for an argument. You can not just take certain verses out. Everything that is said in the Bible works together. They all lead into another.

@Zubz313

It's great that you're trying to evangelize and answer questions that are asked; however, saying stuff like is unnecessary. The Bible is the word of God not the word of the authors. The authors did write the books and letters that makes up the Bible, but it was through God that they were able to do so.

You'll hear no argument from me. I never said that the bible isn't God's word, but people need to know that it was written by that many authors. I believe this give the bible credibility. God did indeed use these people to write his word, and that can be seen by these different people portraying the same God in their writings. I believe that the testimony of over 40 different people that lived in the span of 1500 years to be far more reliable than one person. I find that absolutely facinating.

actually, u r pretty damn WRONG!!
word of god? have u even READ the bible? its completely the autors point of view on stuff!
and the bible does not support itself. all books actually go against eachother! what do u think we need bible translators for?! to figure out the REAL meaning.
for example. even in "bereshit" the first book. it first sez "and god created the light and darkness" after a few lines "and god created light". so WHEN did he create the light? on the first day or the 3rd?
i dont know what version u read, but read again.

"The authors did write the books and letters that makes up the Bible, but it was through God that they were able to do so."

HUH?! now what do u mean by that? the spirit of god got into the autors or sumthing?! let me tell you something. everything god-related in the bible r qoutes from ppl who claimed to hear the voice of "godS of israel". in my opinion. they said it to manipulate the ppl to obey them. kinda like
"go wash hands before dinner!"
"dont wanna"
"god came to me in a dream and said all ppl must wash their hands before dinner!"
"yessir, going to wash my hands sir, im a loyal follower of god sir!"

Last edited by moritana at 5:46 pm, Jul 23 2007

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the best security guard, EVER.

The topic has been pretty flame free thus far.

And I was expelled for claiming agnotism, and talking back to teachers.

Once I saw the title, I knew this topic would go on and on and on. Quite frankly, I've never even touched my bible-I got it because it was for free- since every time I try reading it, I find myself utterly confused . I do find it a bit ridiculous since I've spent my life without the bible and church though. I'm sure it makes sense up to some point to the believers.


Summer catholic school killed me. It was more like a girl scout thing though. They made us remember lines. T_T Anyways, it killed me.And my sister started believing in it for a while.You know what happens when a sister with supreme skills at making people annoyed starts believing in a religion? It turns into complete chaos, and I really mean it when I say COMPLETE CHAOS. I'm glad she didn't have access to the internet back then.

You got expelled for talking back to teachers?O_O My classmates can set the classroom on fire while arguing with my teacher and get away with only a week suspension.

hmm once my 9th grade class played volley-chair-desk over my teachers head, burned stuff, wrestled and played hard rock through cellphones, and no one was punished... poor teacher.. oh.. and were considered a pretty good school... you can only get in if ur grades r above 75%...

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the best security guard, EVER.