not sure if it was mentioned but Otani from Lovely Complex

Quote from ranmaru

Quote from tsuto

Quote from ladyviollet

85% of shoujo heroines.

95% of romance oriented shonen mangas main character

yup both are true XD wonder why mangakas don't make smart characters...it's annoying to read a manga where the hero/heroine is a retard...

Well if the character was smart, I would think the character would hold off and avoid all relationships until the person was older (since in reality a person isn't going find his or her soulmate at 14 years old, if one even believes in a soulmate or everlasting love).

I guess this is also why I tend to read books (haven't touched manga in a while) where the characters are older than the teenage years since there's a lot of confusion and change running around there. I'm also not immediately labelling the female character TSTL (= to stupid to live), or at least I very rarely apply that label.

Or if it's indecision that's annoying you, I guess that's the issue with reading harem/love triangle type stories. The story ends when the character picks who she or he wants to be with, if the mangaka doesn't choose something open-ended. 🤢 ... 🤣

4-3-1 posts

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Quote from Takiko

Well if the character was smart, I would think the character would hold off and avoid all relationships until the person was older (since in reality a person isn't going find his or her soulmate at 14 years old, if one even believes in a soulmate or everlasting love).

Not necessarily true. My aunt and uncle met when still in high school and have been married for like, 22 years. My cousin met her man in the 10th grade and they are getting married next month.

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Quote from ahoaho

Quote from tsuto

Quote from ladyviollet

85% of shoujo heroines.

95% of romance oriented shonen mangas main character

99% of harem leads

Pretty much summarizes 😛 all my hates except a few more additions from other comments..the last two inclusive and if not, where the girl looks like a loli and the guy looks like 10 years older! In fact, all guys in mangas who happen to have odd interest in loli-types sicken me, like that Battle programmer Shirase but thats an anime...

Quote from Domonkazu

@smichal: ippo isn't a romance manga XD

I'd say Takayuki Narumi from Kimi ga Nozomu Eien, he is the worst.

I cant quite affirm most of the choices here as I religiously avoid anime/mangas like School days, Ichigo 100% etc after suffering from Kimi ga Nozomu eien or whatever that is called. In fact, I avoid that art style specifically unless i can get any such manga recommended...I saw Kimi ga Nozomu Eien anime, dint read the manga, its pretty frustrating what low means the long haired girl took though she had my support all along....it just sorta tainted the whole thing..

Quote from ahoaho

I'm really annoyed by half the characters in Hatsukoi Limited

I like the emotions behind this and maybe not so annoying but the most popular girl-don remember her name annoys me since I dont see why she should be popular, in fact, i think the only couple i like is that swimmer couple n Kusuda-Kei- the latter couple is rather interesting...its nice to c a loser boy and popular gal after so many sucky shoujos of loser girl n ugh-cool guys..

Quote from lialah

Still, my top two biggest idiots in a romance plot have to be Hatsumi from Hot Gimmick and Hiyoko from Love Monster. I can tolerate denseness pretty well from some characters, but for some reason these two really REALLY bugged me.

Hiyoko was the exact reason I stopped reading the manga altogether from chapter 1 even though this manga seems to be very popular 😕 How can a girl be so clueless and dumb? n the silly main gal of Hot Gimmick, falls for her harasser? like Shinjo Mayu's heroines, all borderline masochistic women are really sickening..

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Mugi from Pastel

not sure if it was mentioned but Otani from Lovely Complex

But, he was upfront about being indecisive and figured out what he wanted pretty fast (in shoujo terms), so he's pretty good for the average shoujo lead (in the non-SM comedies, where of course the guys slept with every girl in school.)

Quote from BimboSilly

Hiyoko was the exact reason I stopped reading the manga altogether from chapter 1 even though this manga seems to be very popular 😕 How can a girl be so clueless and dumb?

I'm still reading and and I totally agree with you-but then again most shoujo heroines tend to be worse than their shounen counterparts (at least the boys tend to be given common sense or a calm personality or something-the girls are always high strung idiots.) Ah, still reading 'cause it has a plot of sorts, and those are difficult to find.

Though actually, my vote for biggest idiot couple in shoujo is for couples were they've both got some (even lots) of brains-Ouran, YamaNada, and S&A are in the painfully dragging it stage.

With shounens, I gave up on tru-love-ru ages ago, but Rito totally gets my vote. He's got ton's of hot girls all over him (including the girl he likes and the adorable Lala) and when I gave up (somewhere in the 70's) he still wasn't getting anywhere with anybody.

Quote from ahoaho

Quote from Takiko

Well if the character was smart, I would think the character would hold off and avoid all relationships until the person was older (since in reality a person isn't going find his or her soulmate at 14 years old, if one even believes in a soulmate or everlasting love).

Not necessarily true. My aunt and uncle met when still in high school and have been married for like, 22 years. My cousin met her man in the 10th grade and they are getting married next month.

Well there are exceptions to everything of course! 😛 But I guess you just wanted to challenge me (not like any die-hard romances would've started bawling upon reading my opinion).

[color=green]+++++++ I also forgot to add this in my previous post:

What is considered "smart" is subjective. From the character's perspective, the reasoning behind there decision is the right or "smart" one. Whereas, as a reader, we can see why the decision is not "smart". It's a bit like looking at one's own past, or where things are better in retrospect.[/color]

Also, I guess to add to the idiot protagonist and my argument, there was the girl in S+M. She's 13 years old and has low self-esteem, so that's partly why she makes somewhat bad decisions that just snowball as the volumes continue. The guy she picks (who dropped his girlfriend) is not just an @$$hole, he's actually much worse (at least to me). The sort of nicer twin isn't ideal boyfriend material either (in the short story it's revealed that he's a two-timer).

With a story like that, even if it's fictional, I don't support young relationships/dating since the footing doesn't seem as equal, and plus I think half of the stuff happening is hormone-driven. And sometimes people (even not young people but it's suppose to lessen as we get older...) make life-altering bad decisions. Plus there was the big local news story about the 13 year-old model girl that hung out with some people and they decided to rape and murder her, and plus some companions felt threatened enough that they said that's why they didn't rescue her. I'm not a mom (and don't expect to for a long while) maybe being one of those parents saying, "You're not allowed to date until you're 25 years old," and it doesn't sound nuts. 😐

I don't know if the S+M gal is the biggest TSTL gal. I think even Miaka from Fushigi Yuugi would've stopped poisoning herself after the first cup but the gal just keeps coming back for more. She should've packed her bags and moved, but I guess she wanted a boyfriend too badly. And of course there were no parents (or none with brains) to save the girl from her own stupidly...

And since someone has brought up couples, I guess Tamahome and Miaka are probably there, right? The "Tamahome!" "Miaka" exchange was probably high on the annoyance scale.

[color=#990066]My avatar was Yves Saint Laurent's The Black Evening Dress (with big bow) first shown in 1983, photographed from his 2002 retrospective and final show.[/color] [color=#CC0066]Check out some of his collections for free (pre-2008) HERE[/color] [color=#CC0066]courtesy of FirstView[/color].

Two words: Junpei Manaka.

Goodness, he can't choose who to be with..... 😔 😔

I read so much mangas, I'm too lazy to watch anime! 😛 😛 😛

Manga I'm loving ATM: Heart no Kuni no Alice

A lot of people seem to pick Manaka from Ichigo100%. That's a fair choice, but then again, a lot of harem leads are indecisive (although his was a bit more than usual). However, if you really want to know what a true idiot is, then watch the anime "School Days". Although Manaka was indecisive, Makoto from School Days is a complete prick. Watch School Days, and Manaka will look like a saint compared to Makoto.

[quote]

Quote from story645

not sure if it was mentioned but Otani from Lovely Complex

But, he was upfront about being indecisive and figured out what he wanted pretty fast (in shoujo terms), so he's pretty good for the average shoujo lead (in the non-SM comedies, where of course the guys slept with every girl in school.)

I never read the manga perhaps it took a different route from the anime, but considering that the leading girl told him twice up front that she liked him and he still didn't get it doesn't seem all too fast to me.

Its not how fast he realizes her but how bog of an idiot he is. In the timeline of that show i think it takes about 1.5 years plus the help of that bi shounen sensei just to get him to be honest.

Still don't see how Manaka Junpei even chose that girl in the end.

Also, I second that the guy from School Days is a prick especially in the later episodes he just can't help himself.

You guys havent read Haru yo, Koi? That male lead is such a stupid bastard that I have to give up reading it.

Considering its genre is Adult Ecchi Romance Yuri (some lezzie stuff in there), and its art is quite okay, its story not bad for a near-hentai you understand how stupid and exasparating he is.

I read plenty of indecisive characters in both normal manga and hentai, but that boy must be the top idiot.

Another vote for Junpei Manaka.

Although he wasn't a douchebag like Makoto, he still strung along a lot of girls who god knows what they saw in him and then ended up with the same girl he asked out thinking she was someone else... and what annoyed me was when they threw in that one androphobic girl at the very end who some people supported but knew 100% wasn't going to get anywhere.

Satsuki had my support for a while but I was expecting her to be a more tsundere-type character which threw me though a loop when she turned out to be so clingy and possessive (which might have been the mangaka's intention). I still rooted for Tsukasa pretty much 90% of the time just because I don't like meek girls which pretty much sums up Aya.

The only thing I got against Manaka is that he's no greedy at all.

Come on! Grab them all and change the genre into harem and hentai already!

Manaka may have strung around a lot (3) girls, but he didn't cheat with multiple girls, nor did he mentally damage any girl. Makoto did all of that (lost count of how many girls he slept with during the course of that series). If you really think about it, he was everything wrong with Manaka (indecisive) and then some.

I think we can all agree what a big douche Makoto is.

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