No, I enjoy it and I believe you're allowed to have the opinion that it sucks. However, if we go by sheer numbers the amount of people, old and young, that read and enjoy Naruto far out number the few like yourself, who don't. I don't mean to say it's the greatest work of literary fiction that some seem to think it is, but it is certainly not as god awful as you like to portray it.

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Quote from silverado

It sounds like you're saying: "Yes, Naruto sucks, but it's the best of its sucky kind." If that's your logic, then you just admitted defeat.

I'm not saying that.. 🙂 Please copy the text where I explicitly said that..

'Naruto'(Shounen) is fighting with a story, and a little bit of drama..

Seinen is mature, with philosiphical questions.. It makes you think.. It's also usually more dark and 'real'..

So if Naruto was a Seinen, it wouldn't meet the expectations of that genre, but since it's a Shounen, it qualifies to the specifics of that genre.. It has fighting, a plot and a little drama..

P.S.: The cars were just an example.. But let me give you another example, so you can understand.. 🙂 You don't compare Romance movies, with Horror..

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Quote from silverado

It's a kiddy manga with some but insignificant elements of a mature manga. There's nothing special about that topic which would require a M rating. If those reader like naruto, so be it. It's not up to us to decide whether they have taste or not. But you can't classify Naruto as mature manga while the main target group are still kids in elementary school. In other words you can't turn shit into gold. You can hype it and hope to make it even more popular as it already is. But you can't expect the mature audience to turn its opinion about Naruto. I like none of common shonen series, but in my opinion Naruto is far worse than Bleach or Naruto simply due to the slow character development and its boring story. They should just kill off all Akatsuki including Sasuke and Itachi. Make Naruto Hokaga and conquer all other countries. THAT would make an interesting plot and room for new character development, don't you think?

Ok, first off, i really don't know why you bumped this thread if you were going to argue on the false premise that All shounen manga is bad in the first place. But anyhow,

You're sort of right in the sense that the main demographic is probably children-young adults. But that doesn't mean its catered solely to them. I would definitely say that some of the scenes with intense emotions would appeal to an older demographic. Just look at Daedalus. I'm almost positive he's not a kid, and although I don't agree with him that Naruto is a literary masterpiece, he has brought up enough examples at least of why you are wrong.

And Dr.Love, I wouldn't say that's true 😀 Shounen and Seinen are just labels for their target demographic. To quote NeoFireHawk, who always yells at people for mislabeling things

Quote from NeoFireHawk

You must understand that the only requirement for a title to be seinen is to be aimed to an 18–30 year old male audience (hence, the "seinen" name). The idea that seinen mangas have to be mature and depth to be considered as such is only a broad stereotype.

and vice versa... 😀

Can't read >_<

So a shounen can be mature, since there are mature adolescences.. And a seinen can be childish, since there are childish adults..

Is that what you mean..?

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Quote from Dr. Love

So a shounen can be mature, since there are mature adolescences.. And a seinen can be childish, since there are childish adults..

Is that what you mean..?

in not those words, sorta. I mean for example a shonen could have thought provoking/psychological aspects to it, and other such adult themes (romance/sexuality?) while seinen can have more comedic elements to it.

What I'm saying is the Shonen/Seinen titles don't necessarily indicate plot elements for a manga, just its target demographic. 😀

Can't read >_<

Like always it's a matter of taste and point of view. If you compare naruto to any other manga regardless of its genre than you see it's a low ranking manga. Well, if you compare it to other shonen series like Bleach, Naruto and Co than it's still third rated. There are some ppl who recently started Naruto and jumped on the hype train. It's not bad, but they tend to overrate the beginning part of Naruto, which was quite good. The current storyline and development simply sucks in everything. Whenever I read a naruto chapter it feels like 30% nonsense, 5% idiotic humour and 65% filler scenes. That's why I personally think that there's no room on my 500 GB disk for this low ranking manga.

Quote from UberZombie

Quote from Dr. Love

So a shounen can be mature, since there are mature adolescences.. And a seinen can be childish, since there are childish adults..

Is that what you mean..?

in not those words, sorta. I mean for example a shonen could have thought provoking/psychological aspects to it, and other such adult themes (romance/sexuality?) while seinen can have more comedic elements to it.

What I'm saying is the Shonen/Seinen titles don't necessarily indicate plot elements for a manga, just its target demographic. 😀

an example would be Mirai Nikki for Shounen and Azumanga Daioh for Seinen...is that what you mean?

Quote from blakraven66

an example would be Mirai Nikki for Shounen and Azumanga Daioh for Seinen...is that what you mean?

I never read Mirai Nikki but Azumanga Daioh is a pretty good example for seinen. Or Potemayo. 😀

Quote from silverado

Like always it's a matter of taste and point of view. If you compare naruto to any other manga regardless of its genre than you see it's a low ranking manga. Well, if you compare it to other shonen series like Bleach, Naruto and Co than it's still third rated. There are some ppl who recently started Naruto and jumped on the hype train. It's not bad, but they tend to overrate the beginning part of Naruto, which was quite good. The current storyline and development simply sucks in everything. Whenever I read a naruto chapter it feels like 30% nonsense, 5% idiotic humour and 65% filler scenes. That's why I personally think that there's no room on my 500 GB disk for this low ranking manga.

So, When comparing with Bleach and One Piece, what makes you like them better. (personally i like One Piece better but thats just me). You just said above "It's not bad" when before you said its terrible. please stay consistant or else i will become confused lol. Anyway, im just curious what about the current Naruto arc you don't like. or rather were you stopped liking it. 😀

Can't read >_<

Quote from ShadwsofArchonia

Ok let's break this down. If you want a plausible opinion/review, then here it is.

Naruto up till the pre-time skip was a fairly decent Shonen manga, it had it's ups and downs. The Art though bland in a few minor cases, was still good and some what refreshing. The plot moved along at a good pace, there was plenty of action and of course blood. There were also some comedic moments and that was the extent of it. Pre-Time Skip.

Now with Post-Time Skip, everything is going to hell. In the beginning it seemed that the manga would keep the momentum it had built up and would then use it to keep everything tightly knit and keep the plot intact. But now it's a bunch of crap, and do mark my words. Naruto manga is a bunch of crap. It's no longer an ingenious work.

The reasons are as follows;

Balance, there is absolutely no sense of it. After the Gaara rescue arc and then finding Sasuke a second time arc. Everything and I do mean everything, fell apart. Kishimoto has taken a liking to unrealistically overpower his antagonists and unrealistically underpower his protagonist.

Prime example would be Sasuke's capability vs. Naruto's capability as of chapter 361. It seems that Sasuke has already surpassed Orochimaru in skill, and now he's well on his way on taking out Deidra. Now if we look at that from a technical standpoint.

Sasuke is capable of taking out two, and I repeat, two S-class Shinobi. While Naruto is incapable of beating Kakashi, who through rank, skill and experience is one, and I once again repeat, one S-class Shinobi. There is FAR too big of a power difference between the two Shinobi. Obviously Sasuke get's to cheat because of the Sharingan, but still. TOO big of a difference.

Character development; Naruto especially. Pre-Time Skip he was an emotional sap, but he had a sense of control. Now post-Time Skip, he's fucking EMO. Nearly every time his temper sparks more than it should, his eyes turn red and slitted. It's true that the seal is weakening, but despite that. Naruto has FAR less control of his emotions making him a much more of a liability than ever before.

Lastly; Capabilities. Sasuke has developed an immense skill in using a Katana, he took down Yamato as if he were a Genin. He has modified the Chidori several different times to make him near unstoppable.

Naruto, Kishimoto gave him the ability to create a new, better, much more deadlier version of the Rasengan. Unfortunately in doing that, he also made it so that. The technique would do more damage to Naruto in the long run than it would to the person the technique was used on. I mean seriously, what the fuck? Why the hell would a character invent a Do-or-Die technique?

Unless of course, the goal of the manga Naruto is for Naruto to die in the end. If that's how the story ends, then and then only I will call it an ingenious piece of work. If he fails to die or some other significant event occurs along the lines similar to death, then it is by far a huge disappointment, and in short. A piece of crap.

There you have a perfectly plausible and backed up by facts as per manga up to 361, opinion/review. Which whole heartedly disagrees with your opinion of Naruto being a ingenious piece of work.

-Shad

i agree full hearted with your post. thats the reason why i barely read this manga any more its like naruto is not even the main character of the whole thing. Cuz i mean i was so looking forward for him to meet up with sasuke to she what he had learn after 3 year of hard train but then what happens he gets punked by sasuke without a fight, which kinda makes the whole time skip thing really pointless. So all in all my real beef with Naruto is slow ass development of the main Character and all the story plotholes from the pre and post time arcs 🤢

Quote from omegakai

i agree full hearted with your post. thats the reason why i barely read this manga any more its like naruto is not even the main character of the whole thing. Cuz i mean i was so looking forward for him to meet up with sasuke to she what he had learn after 3 year of hard train but then what happens he gets punked by sasuke without a fight, which kinda makes the whole time skip thing really pointless. So all in all my real beef with Naruto is slow ass development of the main Character and all the story plotholes from the pre and post time arcs 🤢

I'm actually really curious when, not just you but anyone, started reading Naruto. like what around what month of what year? Because if you started anywhere after the pre time skip manga was finished it would make sense to me that you think the current arc is slow in plot progression. You may not think it would make a difference, but reading something like 238 chapters in a couple days and then reading 139 chapters over a span of 1 chapter per week, i could see how it would feel slow. 😀

Can't read >_<

to answer u i have read up until sasuke fought the atkatsuki or what ever

Quote from UberZombie

I'm actually really curious when, not just you but anyone, started reading Naruto. like what around what month of what year? Because if you started anywhere after the pre time skip manga was finished it would make sense to me that you think the current arc is slow in plot progression. You may not think it would make a difference, but reading something like 238 chapters in a couple days and then reading 139 chapters over a span of 1 chapter per week, i could see how it would feel slow. 😀

I totally agree
if you started naruto like 1 month ago and now your at the latest chapter you would still think its awesome "the best ever" or stuff like that. I bet all the people who now consider naruto a very bad manga/anime are the people who have been with it for at lest 2-3 years because you wait for the newest chapter and after you finally read it you start saying "god, that chapter sucked ass" "I waited a week for this ?"

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actually magnum i was saying the opposite of that, that people who had read the whole first 2-3 arcs back to back in a few days are now finding the current arc terrible and slow because they can't read it all at once. but i see how the opposite could be true too. 😀

Can't read >_<

Naruto was a decent shounen, I liked the fights, it was very exciting to watch/read. but it's faaaaaaar far away from the best out there. you know by time and after reading countless stuff, you will noice the people who just started reading getting crazy over something not so great just like we did whn we started reading, it's pretty normal but it creates a bit of a problem, you see..anime and manga are young in the world eye, many new comers very little reading experience which leads to mangas like Naruto being so popular, while the best stuff will always need to be dug up and while looking around you get to see people screaming around like a false alarm about some average manga >.>; well...you get used to it...

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