I see what you're talking about now. By "friction engine", I assumed you meant something that would drive you forward by itself, such as those toys that you essentially wind up to increase the "internal friction" and then they drive forward.

Like dancwart said, the friction engine you speak of will not work... in a practical way. It's like getting 5 guys to push a car and then expecting the inertia to make it travel a respectable distance when they stop pushing. It'll work somewhat, but it's not worth the effort.

I know you do some planning before you build, but I mean complete planning. Things like planning where the motor will go and how much space the suspension should take up are good, but you need more than that.

Ideally, you would know how much torque you'll get out of your motors, how much they weigh, approximately how fast and how far they'll go, and other such things. With the suspension, you should have an estimate on the height you want it to be able to handle. "Above normal" is not something quantifiable. A normal jumping height for you and another person could vary drastically, depending on quality of frame, weight, and the height you "normally" jump from. Saying "3.5 m with a weight of 63 kg" gives a definite reference point. For the prototype phase, anything that even works a little is fine, but it's not a good specification for a final design. When someone builds a bridge, they don't make it "to hold alot of weight". They build with exact specifications in mind.

If a money is not a problem, then I assume you will not hesitate to buy a $400-$500 set of motors and a 230V battery with the chance that they may not work how you want them to.

Sort of, tho all the the talk ur giving me, its hard to believe that this is actually going to happen, but im working on the schematic and the suspension, im hoping to be able to make a suspension which is adjustable for the weight of the person and so on, but me and my dad have thought up a new theory of a motor, ill will try to use paint or something to introduce the theory for u guys soon, thumbs up!

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*The new version of sierra*

reverse engine prototype 2.0 is finished. we just put the parts together with minimum planning. we don't expect it to work, we just made it so it could lead us somewhere. it work for quite a while. we use car batteries to power it up. but for some reason, the magnet at the centre break into pieces. perhaps electric engine aren't supposed to have the magnets at the centre and the axel is on the outside.


guys. if you know anything 'bout 3d schematic drawing software, pm me. i ain't doing much good with paint alone.

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Let's get Kickin' ...whatever that means

Well guys I just googled Schematic Drawing Software, and although it's not 3d it'll get us somewhere. This one is free I believe so here's the link to it:
http://www.expresspcb.com/ExpressPCBHtm/HowWorks.htm
someone give it a shot and see if it works how you'd like it to. We really should get the schematics going so we can at least say some progress has been made. It would probably also be wise to make multiple schematics and try different design patterns when new ideas are made. If someone can get it working, then I could share more of my ideas with you and see if we can get one drawn up.
Oh yeah, it may not help much, but the AT's in the show had wheel motors, and Mitsubishi and other car companies have started using in-wheel motors on their cars. It most likely wouldn't work, but if one was to attempt to make one quite similar to it and downsize it enough we could probably have a prototype motor to work on that could be tweaked when more technology, or its use becomes available to us? just a suggestion.
*edit* oh yeah i just found some a sight with links to 3d modelers, would that work the same? anyway, here's the link:
http://freebyte.com/cad/cad.htm#2D3DCADSystems

What i could find here is:
A light version of their commercial software. Parametric & feature based 3D modeler, which is fairly easy to use. 2D layout & detailing is fully associative with the 3D model. Shelling & booleans are not offered in this light version, but you are able to "Save" your models. Assembly is limited to 25 components. A powerful computer with lots of RAM is recommended to run this application.
Screenshot
Created by Alibre Inc.
which i think is the best way to go.

Though me and my dad have thought up a new theory of an engine, so this is what we came up with...note this i made in simple oldfashioned paint ^^ lol

Ok, so what i've sort of tried to draw here is a AT with a spool underneith the truck where the wheel sits and the wheel has a magnetic rim so the spool makes the a magnetic field with the wheel and drives it forward, and since the engine also works good as a generator aswell, so u will store up energy aswell, the engine im looking into is a nanomotor made from peizo engery, www.piezomotor.se a swedish company are making those they are obviously very strong since of the size, but the not enough for a person to move upon them, but maybe with a bigger size of the motor it might.

What do you guys think, u might want to check the website in to see if it may provide any information.


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*The new version of sierra*

thanks for the info achilles. kouru, your design is for storing more energy while moving right? like when using a friction engine, we already got small power, but if we add the spool, we can increase power storing right?

achilles, engine inside the wheels is exactly what i'm trying now. the reverse engine that i talked about, where normal electric engines have the axel as centre and magnets surround the axel. my reverse engine is the magnet at the centre and the axel surround them. since the rotation part is on the outside of engine, it would be well to put into the wheels. but it just an idea anyway. the engine kept busting out on me. lol.


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Let's get Kickin' ...whatever that means

I've voiced this topic to my fellow cadets in the Engineering department buut it seems quite impossible with todays technology they said.

Exactly lightning, we will get more power with this type of storing, and seraphz its possible, tell your cadets that. Though we wont be able to make an AT that simply moves u around without u doing anything, its just that we need an extra type of motor to get a little bit faster during skating. at least is that one of my goals, until we get better technology to work with. with todays nanotechnics we can build engines which are as small as normal sized key and they can move triple their on weight.

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*The new version of sierra*

1 of those nanobots is going most likely to cost over 100€ + they give out an incredible size/output ratio, but while i'm waiting for the exact specs my guess is that you'll need at least 100 or so of them. it's true they fit, but this would skyrocket the price of the AT at over 10000€, really not a good choice.

p.s. i don't get the schematic of your engine, can you please post some?

Guys, when i speak here, i speak for quite a few friends. We hope you suceed.
And if you do, we will be so grateful. We cannot afford the items, and we also need quite a bit of knowledge. Best of luck, guys.

And say, if you can, gimme your email. I have a idea for us to find a way to chat better and know each other at the same time.

Dancwart, im not sure which of my schematics u didnt get? or didnt see?

Sorry ^^

*EDIT*
ok, so i've tried to study the series again and see if they give us more "hints" about AT's. and i found something that might give us some potential posibilities.
Episode 5 and 13:56 minutes in on the episode, so for u that have it on your comp check it out. *since its a video, i cant take a screenshot from the video, dont know why its just buggs*

Last edited by Kuorakatsu at 5:38 am, Aug 13 2007

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*The new version of sierra*

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e6/Electric_motor_c ycle_1.png

this is a tipical electric engine. two magnets and a rotor inside that shifts it's polarity every half turn. what i get from your schematic is that you want to put the coil outside (in the wheel) and the fix magnets in the axis. how are you going to manage the polar shift to keep the rotor spinning? that's what i don't get

lol i have explained the wrong way, u got it right, but i told u wrong
sorry, the link u put up is exactly what i meant.

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*The new version of sierra*

if the engine that i put up is what you had in mind, i assure you that you'll never get enough power out of it to speed a preson over 40-50kmh, and those are the speeds that aggressive racers reach. that is because you'll need more than 5hp and i couldn't find a regular electric engine that can give out that much power.

dont really know what to say, im getting sad, feels impossible and i cant make up my mind

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*The new version of sierra*