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http://www.mangaupdates.com/showtopic.php?tid=3903
Previous Poll Results:
Question: If you had an original idea for a story and weren't concerned about money, staff, or personal skill, which medium would be most suitable for your creation?
Choices:
Manga, manhwa, or manhua - votes: 2744 (28.3%)
Western graphic novel - votes: 232 (2.4%)
(Light) novel, book, or short story - votes: 2123 (21.9%)
Live-action movie - votes: 537 (5.5%)
Animated movie - votes: 673 (6.9%)
Live-action TV show - votes: 393 (4.1%)
Animated TV show - votes: 1251 (12.9%)
Game - votes: 1383 (14.3%)
Theatrical play or musical - votes: 74 (0.8%)
Radio show - votes: 20 (0.2%)
Drama cd - votes: 33 (0.3%)
Newspaper cartoon - votes: 32 (0.3%)
Song - votes: 151 (1.6%)
Dance - votes: 56 (0.6%)
There were 9702 total votes.
The poll ended: October 18th 2013
Considering what kind of site this is, no surprises on the winner. But the choice of games got more votes than I would've expected! (I personally chose games too, as I play more video games than I read manga, nowadays)
Comments (limited to first 100 replies)
» misc on October 19th, 2013, 12:12am
» sidzero on October 19th, 2013, 12:15am
» darkraiders on October 19th, 2013, 12:28am
» forgottenone666 on October 19th, 2013, 1:24am
» strixflash on October 19th, 2013, 1:28am
» PROzess on October 20th, 2013, 8:42am
You, yourself can always choose to read the HQ version and like it.
It shouldn't matter what others say about it.
» strixflash on October 21st, 2013, 12:43am
You, yourself can always choose to read the HQ version and like it.
It shouldn't matter what others say about it.
Because those people bring negative publicity to the manga... they rate it low or tell others not to read it just because what they read was LQ release instead of HQ. I hate such baseless criticism for the series I enjoy reading ^^
» yarn on October 19th, 2013, 1:42am
A close second is when a group who says they desperately need more members simultaneously says they're going to take on new series. If they are already stretched thin, why are they taking on more? Well, ultimately they can do what they want. But it just makes me go
» RoxFlowz on October 19th, 2013, 1:56am
» NightSwan on October 19th, 2013, 2:10am
Everything on that list is annoying as hell.
The one that annoys me the least though, is when people nag about the next release, because you can just ignore them.
You can't really do anything about the rest though.
» Perfect1 on October 19th, 2013, 2:24am
If it is not clear. I chose "People who ask: "When will the next chapter be released?"".
Which I read as: "People who incessantly whine/threaten: Where the fuck is the next chapter you lazy bitches and no I don't care if it is not out yet in Japan, give me the fucking chapter!""
Btw, just to make it clear. I don't scanlate, I just loathe the mindset of certain people.
I think you may have forgot a choice in the poll.
"When your favorite manga ends prematurely."
» tactics on October 19th, 2013, 3:03am
I think, being a scanlator myself, I do find people who ask "When's the next chapter released?" really, really annoying. It'll be released when it's done. Shut up and stop asking.
People making money out of it is also pretty bad. As if we need any more targets painted on our backs.
Ugh I dunno which one to go for. They're all damn annoying...
» iamssjvash on October 19th, 2013, 3:13am
» Harimau on October 19th, 2013, 3:41am
On a related note... Someone PLEASE pick up [m]Tomehane[/m].
» Nirhtuc on October 19th, 2013, 5:23am
» nakie08 on October 19th, 2013, 7:54am
^ this definitely. Specially those who steal other's project when it gets popular. A lot of good mangas aren't translated and some groups are just fighting over the popular ones. So much manpower WASTED just to get ahead and become more popular.
» blueflor on October 19th, 2013, 8:23am
Speed scanlations can rot in hell ;D also bad translators and those who think they can translate because they've been learning Japanese for a month... or they can read the alphabet... or the best part because everyone else is delusional and thinks the translator is awesome because they pump out 231219 scripts a week but it's actually just all BS...
//hate//
Oh I picked those people making money off scanlations. I mean sure asking for donations for manga is fine, but spending it on your xbox? PC ?? f no
» Perfect1 on October 19th, 2013, 2:08pm
If you don't like something that isn't perfect then don't read it.
Btw, most of those have popped up because the readers that were too impatient created the need for them so if anything blame the them instead.
And what if a person is a bad translator, why can't he/she use the opportunity to improve by scanlating, what is the harm? He/she might become good in the process and contribute to make those perfect scanlations in the future.
The only instance when I don't like them is when they take on the same project as a HQ group and makes them loose interest in that manga.
» nightazday on October 19th, 2013, 8:47am
I love when multiple scanlators do the same series. This way you're sure the manga can get scanlated. I wish it happened more often than just the big 3.
» tnwls523 on October 19th, 2013, 10:04am
1. When you start a series and then find out: Last Release (1000d ago). Completely Scanlated: No
I usually wait until it's completely scanlated but there are some manga that I just have to start reading and hope that some group will pick them up again.
2. When scanlation stops due to a Cease & Desist
Can't be helped but man, so annoying!!!
3. People making money off scanlations
Yeah, just kill the scanlation community won't you? It's like making something grey all the way black.
4. When a good series stops being scanlated because the group closed
5. When a good series stops being scanlated because it's not popular
6. When a group has too many projects and releases are slow for the series you read
7. People who ask: "When will the next chapter be released?"
8. When multiple groups scanlate the same series
9. Speed scanlations
» quark1020 on October 19th, 2013, 10:15pm
1. Making money of scanlations. If they are doing it legit, being hired by the legal owners of the particular manga, then great job and keep up the good work. Sure, I'll have to pay now, but that's the price I must pay for good quality translation
2. Multiple groups scanlating same series. I'm ignorant to the world behind scanlations and don't know what the big deal is. However, when multiple groups do one manga, there seems to be more hatred in the group's forums than usual, so that sucks.
3. Speed scanlations. Some are crap, but if I love the series a lot, I just can't wait to see the plot continue.
4. Group with too many projects. Sucks that releases are slower, but if the group wants to do that many manga, then who am I to stop them.
5. Leechers whining. As I said before: I do not work in scanlations and I do not create anything that others find good enough to rush me. Still, even I think that's just rude.
6. Starting a dead series. This sucks, but I know better than to start a series that isn't being worked on anymore and isn't licensed.
7. Group closed. Normally, this would fall under number 6, but if it happens suddenly to me, I would be very, very sad. However, I've been lucky enough that a particular series will be picked up by either another group or a splinter faction of the previous.
8. Cease & Desist. If I'm reading a manga that's been licensed online, its either because the manga has been horribly done or the scanlation is hundreds of chapters ahead and pumped out at a faster rate while maintaining quality. I understand that what is being done isn't exactly legal, or morally justified, but come ON! A group of volunteers on their spare time should not be doing a better job than a group of god damned, paid professionals.
9. A good series not being popular. This simply breaks my heart. If its not popular, it will likely never be licensed so I have no way of reading it shy of learning the language. I'll admit, its less of a hate, but I definitely have a stronger emotional reaction.
10. People making money off scanlations. Yes, I know, I mentioned this previously, but this one is the other side of the coin: People stealing others work and selling it as though it was their own, or simply selling their own work without consideration of the legal owners. Both are horrible offenses, casting a very bad light to an already questionable system.
Glad I got that off my chest, sorry for the long post and thanks for reading if you did.
» mizunosaki on October 19th, 2013, 10:42am
But seriously though to address the choices:
[When multiple groups scanlate the same series]
Seriously dude, people scanlate what they want to scanlate. Just because one group has done it doesn't mean that group has the exclusive rights to it. Let them do it, it's no skin off your back.
[When a group has too many projects and releases are slow for the series you read]
Again, people scanlate what they want to scanlate. They want to work on 10 projects? They will work on 10 projects. People have different methods and ways of working. Sometimes just working on 5 projects get boring. And guess what, scanlators do it for fun. If it's not fun anymore, they can quit.
[When a good series stops being scanlated because it's not popular]
This is kinda the opposite spectrum. I think this can be pegged to 'lack of manpower' as in nobody's really interested in doing it. A lot of you have been moaning about maximizing the manpower and not work on the same project with other groups. Can you blame them for focusing their manpower on the popular projects? Make more people happy and all that?
[When a good series stops being scanlated because the group closed]
Shit happens. Life happens. If it's really that great of a series, other groups will pick it up. Sometimes a group closes because it's not rewarding. If you think about the amount of work they put into it and the amount of appreciation they get for it (hint: it's not equal) I can understand why scanlators want to call it quits.
[When you start a series and then find out: Last Release (1000d ago). Completely Scanlated: No]
-points upwards-
[People who ask: "When will the next chapter be released?"]
Look, I totally get that you're DYING to know what happens next. But just in case you don't know, scanlators don't owe you anything. They have real life too. Hobbies stop being hobbies when they get demanding.
[Speed scanlations]
Is this a term for 1 hour scanlation with sloppy translation and editing? Well, it's there because people get so impatient about the next chapter, isn't it? You demand, they provide. Why the complaint? You get to choose two from FAST, GOOD, or CHEAP. Since cheap is non negotiable because it's FREE, then choose between fast or good. Speed Scanlation is obviously the fast one.
[People making money off scanlations]
Every group is different for this, but I do agree that this is basically making money from other people's copyright.
Groups that ask for donations are different though. Donations are for people to show their appreciation, it's not a charge. Donations are for people who acknowledges that there are people who use their resources to make the scanlation available for free, and they appreciate that.
And there you have it. Just got to get that off my chest.
» SinsI on October 19th, 2013, 12:17pm
» hatsumimi99 on October 19th, 2013, 12:34pm
I don't mind people asking when the next release will be, but I hate it when they email me personally to tell me that I promised to release something and didn't. (Stuff happens, people. For me, especially, LOTS of stuff happens.)
I guess what pisses me off the most would be people making money off of scanlations. That's just plain dirty.
» Transdude1996 on October 19th, 2013, 12:52pm
» Kina92 on October 19th, 2013, 2:46pm
It's also horrifying when an awesome series is canceled because of a group closing. TT~TT
» Galooza on October 19th, 2013, 2:55pm
As a reader, definitely picking up a series and seeing either 2 years since last release or a release every 2-3 months when all the volumes are out.
» bibisuki on October 19th, 2013, 3:06pm
- When you start a series and then find out: Last Release (1000d ago). Completely Scanlated: No
- Speed scanlations
- When a good series stops being scanlated because the group closed
I can't decide which one irritates me the most. But right now I'm being tortured by:
- Suki Desu Suzuki-kun!!
- Suki tte ii na yo
I don't know when the chapters are going to be released, in Suki Desu Suzuki-kun!!'s case, the manga is already complete as well as [m]Chitose etc[/m], even if they dont catch as much attention as others do, I don't care, I like them. Even when people criticize [m]Chitose etc[/m] I haven't read it, but I will cause I really like YOSHIZUMI Wataru works. Like recently she is working on Marmalade Boy Little which made me so happy. I totally fell in love with her art and her stories.
Kiss kara Hajimaru this was one of my first, but at that time I didn't know it wasn't complete
Only You - Tobenai Tsubasa has so much potential, but nobody would pick it up. It only got 8 volumes and it's complete.
» mysstris on October 19th, 2013, 3:26pm
When a group has too many projects and releases are slow for the series you read
because it annoys me the most since there is this strange consensus on scanlating that if one group scans, another can't. There are special cases of course but it depends on the scanlator groups.
I hate this one group that has over 100 projects ACTIVE and they still take on new ones!! Because of that, I've refused to read any new projects by this group. It seems so pointless for them to do that. This is beyond just having slow releases. It's more like NO RELEASES
When multiple groups scanlate the same series
I welcome this. translators do things differently depending on the person so you can get a completely different translation depending on the translator and PR.
When a good series stops being scanlated because it's not popular
This is just a terrible excuse for stopping. I rarely encounter this (once in a blue moon) but what annoys me is when a publisher does this. This actually happened to Tokyopop before they came down. They were publishing this one series I was really into and then they stopped. Idk if it's popularity or w/e but seriously, that annoyed the heck out of me.
When a good series stops being scanlated because the group closed
Unfortunate but here's to hoping another group picks it up! It doesn't piss me off b/c it just might mean that people have their lives to live.
When you start a series and then find out: Last Release (1000d ago). Completely Scanlated: No
it's annoying but it doesn't piss me off unless it's a group like the one I mentioned having over 100 projects. Other than that, it might mean the group is inactive/closed. And because of this possibility, recently I've been more inclined to search for completed mangas to read. Of course there are exceptions such as some of the more popular mangas that are being scanlated today but other than those, I try to go for more completed now.
People who ask: "When will the next chapter be released?"
I hate it when people do that too!! but people who ask are usually noobs and don't know much about the scanlating world and the fact that this is real people who have their own lives doing this in their own "free" time.
Speed scanlations
If it's good quality like the speed scanning of Aizen-sensei who did Choukakou and another series, then I'm good.
When scanlation stops due to a Cease & Desist
Well they cant' do much about it. It sucks but it's better than getting in trouble legally.
People making money off scanlations
one of the most irksome things about aggregate sites like MF and all of NOEZ's sites. But what annoys me more about that is that people remain ignorant of sites like MF and think that they do all of the work.
People who ask for donations....I'm not too sure I like that idea. If you look at Sura's place, sura doesn't ask for donations at all and she buys TWO issues of the magazine that she scans from. She also has been doing this for quite a long time, 1998 is when she started scanlating/founded Janime. I have more appreciation and respect for Sura because of that since she's paying out of pocket but yeah...idk I guess it's a hopeful investment. (hopeful in the sense that you hope the manga you enjoy will be the manga they use the money for)
» psycho-shocker on October 19th, 2013, 4:44pm
It's really is stupid, why don't they join project? Or the later group start scanlate other series? The selfishness of human know no bounds
It's just wasting time and effort. Except the previous group's work is in bad quality (I'm fine with low quality, though) and the later group pick the series to fix it.
» jj11103 on October 19th, 2013, 9:31pm
» hahhah42 on October 20th, 2013, 12:16am
Don't forget that a lot of people - even among visitors to this site - prefer online readers to downloading, and a series dropped by the scanlators long ago may still be a recent upload on any given online reader.
As for my choice, I was deliberating between the "not popular" and "group closed" options, and eventually settled upon the "not popular." Although depending upon how/why the group closes, it could easily go the other way.
» whitespade on October 19th, 2013, 9:47pm
» Lanz16 on October 19th, 2013, 11:13pm
I have lots of issues regarding to the scanslators like for example on the choices:
When you start a series and then find out: Last Release (1000d ago). Completely Scanlated: No
The good example for this is Itazura Na Kiss (The last time I check this series was 5 years ago, and still haven't released new chapter and eventually, the group closed for good), YAWARA! (I really LOVE this series until the chapter releases becomes ridiculously slow and I lost my interest reading it), Jig + Zag (Same scenario as YAWARA!), Flat (AOGIRI Natsu) and Yasuko to Kenji (One of my few Mangas that I truly love and the group is already closed/lack-of-interest-to-scanslate which makes me mad the most) and a-lot more!
When a group has too many projects and releases are slow for the series you read
I don't like some scanslation group that had a tons of projects and when my favorite series that I'm reading there keeps hanging for, worse, a long period of time.
When a good series stops being scanlated because it's not popular
Well, this issue is hard to ignore. Especially when there are lot of people are waiting for it.
Instead of "It's not popular", it should be "They lost their interest to scanslating it".
When a good series stops being scanlated because the group closed
This rarely happens to me.
» KaoriNite on October 19th, 2013, 11:21pm
I didn't select the "Last Release (1000d ago). Completely Scanlated: No" option because I always check before I start reading to see if the story has been completed. I actually try to only read manga that is already completed because I never know if a group is going to be able to finish a series. I think most of the series listed on this site are unfinished and have been dropped by their scanlators for one reason or another.
Also, I don't get annoyed by people who ask: "When will the next chapter be released?" If I wasn't lazy and actually bothered to write to scanlators, I would be one of these people. In a case where its been months or even years since a chapter has been released, why can't I ask the scanlator what is happening with the manga? I feel like if you decide to take on a job you should try to complete that job as best as you can.
I also don't get annoyed when multiple groups do the same series. This means that the series has a better chance of actually getting completed.
» arouraleona on October 20th, 2013, 12:07am
» icarusbride on October 20th, 2013, 12:53am
» mysstris on October 21st, 2013, 2:45pm
» Fantasier on October 20th, 2013, 4:24am
» mysstris on October 20th, 2013, 7:52am
Also about the option where it says "people asking when the next release is" that was just so randomly stuck in there. I felt like most of the options were related pretty well to the scanlators directly or the scanlating world. People asking when the next release is, I feel like that's asking for people who have or do scanlate to choose that option.
» Fantasier on October 20th, 2013, 8:22am
This reply is off-topic here though.
» mysstris on October 21st, 2013, 2:55pm
» Kurapica on October 20th, 2013, 8:15am
» PROzess on October 20th, 2013, 8:52am
1) The reader is lazy (2, 3, 4, 5)
2) Official Publisher Interference (8, 9)
3) Scanlator POV (1, 6, 7)
The reader himself can solve half of these problems himself as 1) shows.
Want to read a manga, but slow/no scanlation?
Then fucking start an own group.
I did the same. I studied Japanese for 3 years and then started to scanlate a project that had been abandoned. Why can't you do so yourself? Japanese is difficult? Oh please, dont kid me.
At the end of the day, reader are just selfish pricks that are too lazy to even lift a single finger (except for browsing the online reader) for their hobby.
Yes, this post was written from the POV of a very annoyed scanlator
» T1 on October 20th, 2013, 9:04am
The readers will either cry, call you a hypocrite, tell you to stop (I told you hentai scanlations is a better community.They only want to fap), flame you etcetc BUT THEY WON'T WORK FOR THEIR TITLE.
It's their right to get the releases for free
We...sorry, I mean scanlators have for years screamed about mangafox and NOEZ and how it should leave bad taste in the readers mouth if they went there....but did it work? No. They couldn't do the easiest thing out of all there.
Now the dude got pocket pirates and pocket ninja and otakushop (saying something about fair use to sell counterfeit products?) and who knows what more out on the net. It a business running illegally in china using free scanlation work. All this is done by using the readers who just want their releases and nothing else.
So expecting them to actually work for their manga releases, lololololololololololol please. I know you aren't that naive.
You know what the best thing about all this is? Only a few percentage of the readers do actually come to mu anymore because of online readers, and much less do check this part of the forum.
This poll was stupid from the beginning. 3 different demographs D:
» Perfect1 on October 21st, 2013, 12:18pm
I mean who in their right mind would pay for something that can just as easily be found on another non-profit manga site.
Although obviously alot of "online reader" people come here and vote since the most stupid of the choices is in the lead.
» T1 on October 22nd, 2013, 6:56am
Idiots tell other idiots about that site.
@2
It's free. The problem is that Mangafox (owned by NOEZ company) and other online readers are earning on the readers click on each single page on their reader. This is cool enough...just illegal. Plus it puts scanlators who are already in the gray zone, totally in bad light with the legal world. Also the problem is when NOEZ mainly takes those money and use them for making games and counterfeit shops which people think are legal and earn money on selling stuff.
So the profit comes to them without the readers knowing. Those who knows (talking about online readers fanbase) don't case since they just want their release.
@3
Yes but the question is do they read the forum, do they care? No!
They motto is: Well if some group gets banned, close their doors or gets angry and drop the title....then someone else will do it. Otherwise there's lots of titles to pick from.
» Perfect1 on October 22nd, 2013, 11:33am
I just don't understand why it seems like some people feel that they are more entitled to make demands on something that is free than for something he/she would pay for.
» doki-doki-kimochi on October 20th, 2013, 12:52pm
1) The reader is lazy (2, 3, 4, 5)
2) Official Publisher Interference (8, 9)
3) Scanlator POV (1, 6, 7)
The reader himself can solve half of these problems himself as 1) shows.
Want to read a manga, but slow/no scanlation?
Then fucking start an own group. ...
Um, no disrespect or anything as I myself am studying Japanese as well, but some people just don't have that opportunity. Please don't patronize them for not being able to go and learn Japanese, start their own groups, etc.
It's also very annoying that you call readers selfish pricks. If you view them this way, don't even make a group and release anything. Not to be ungrateful, but scanlators translate and release manga in because they want to share with others but they can't have access to, and readers are in turn grateful for this and support scanlation groups while not being needy/whiny. Obviously this it the ideal relationship, but there ARE people who feel this way.
Some scanlators may view this poll as an insult/disrespect, but truly the majority of people view scanlators in a good light and are grateful to them, but because there lies in fault in everything, we're just taking a poll on how people feel about these faults. Really, if you wanted to you could make a poll about what pisses you off the most about readers, but at the end of the day it's just a poll.
» mubotter2 on October 20th, 2013, 1:19pm
» doki-doki-kimochi on October 20th, 2013, 2:46pm
And if you're studying a language at all, you'll know that you can't learn it and become fluent/well-versed just by reading resources off the internet. You need practice by living in the country or having formal instruction.
I am a reader that gets annoyed by the reasons mentioned in this poll, obviously, because I voted on it myself. But that doesn't mean I can't overlook these facts. It's the same thing either way whether you're a scanlator or a reader.
» sophie0 on October 20th, 2013, 3:05pm
And while I don't think people who read scanlations should just learn Japanese, I agree that if they have time to complain about scanlations not being fast or good enough or whatever, they could use that time to learn Japanese. Or learn some manners
» PROzess on October 21st, 2013, 4:08am
And if you're studying a language at all, you'll know that you can't learn it and become fluent/well-versed just by reading resources off the internet. You need practice by living in the country or havin ...
No, you don't need to live in the country itself. Maybe if you're after a job in that field, but if you're learning japanese in self-study for manga, then it's pretty much feasible in 2-3 years.
Trust me, I did that.
Again, it are just excuses.
To begin with, my argument was directed at the people who complain about the release speed.
If you are content with the situation at it is and patiently can wait for the release, then there's no need to learn japanese yourself. Just enjoy reading.
My point is, that some leecher whine for years "where's the next release" and if they had used the time instead for studying, they would be at a level where they can read now.
» doki-doki-kimochi on October 21st, 2013, 5:53pm
Two, don't backtrack on what you said. Perhaps you implied that your comment was directed at people who complain about releases, but it still remains the fact that you said, "At the end of the day, reader are just selfish pricks that are too lazy to even lift a single finger (except for browsing the online reader) for their hobby." It's not only rude, but also untrue.
» PROzess on October 22nd, 2013, 6:32am
EVERYONE is making excuses about "we have a life" "we dont have the resource". The fuck? Are you living in some cave in the mountains?
You always CAN find a way and the time to learn Japanese, but most of the people are lazy. But all they ever do is find excuses.
Do you think I'm some rich snob that has all the time in the world? Heck no. Still, I managed to set time aside for studying. Now stop telling me that you can't do the same.
Therefore it's not untrue that it applies to all readers.
Either way, the rudeness reader direct at scanlators can't even be compared with this.
» T1 on October 22nd, 2013, 7:04am
Sure I'm not fluent but do you need to be fluent to read or speak? O.o
What a funny thing to say.
If you want you can. If you don't want to you can't. Now if you don't want to admit that you don't want to then in comes the excuses.
Last thing...a hobby is something you use time on. If you can use time on reading manga then you can use time on learning how to read in Japanese so you can read your manga. That's a hobby. Kinda like climbing mountains (I just finished watching Yama no Susume ) where you just don't start at the top but slowly start with finding out how the gear works, what you need to climb the mountain and practice on small mountains and climbing walls..aye it's still a hobby but you do something before you are capable of doing it. If that was too hard an example then I shall pick an easier one: Playing chess. You learn the rules before you play and practice to get better so you can play against stronger opponent.
Same thing with Japanese and untranslated manga...you should know what I'm referring to since you study the language. ^^
» KaoriNite on October 20th, 2013, 10:56pm
» nakie08 on October 21st, 2013, 12:10am
Anyway, you can help with more ways than just translating. If you're a native english speaker, proofread. Proofreading 1 chapter won't even take you an hour. I'm sure that if you have time reading manga, you surely have time for that. If you know basic photo editing, typeset or clean. A couple of months ago I even saw someone in the recruiting section offering to help moderate a scanlation team's forum. It's really easy to learn the basics too, even if you don't have prior experience in photo editing etc. There are TONS of materials out there that you can learn from. Tutorials, forum threads, video tutorials on youtube. Some scanlation group even offer to TEACH YOU how to. Point is, all it really comes down to is how much you want to help.
» KaoriNite on October 21st, 2013, 12:56am
for me, this statement is similar to all the scanlators who have been writing "if you have a problem with the scanlations then you should do them yourself or stop complaining". it goes both ways. if you have a problem with reactions of some of the readers, then realize that you have no obligation to this job for them. and yeah, i'm one of those readers who don't help out, but hopefully i haven't been one of those ungrateful readers who complain about every detail of scanlating to the point that scanlators want to quit.
» Galooza on October 21st, 2013, 3:15pm
» KaoriNite on October 21st, 2013, 5:44pm
I was making my one-sided comment (only about ungratefuls) because that's what the other scanlators were focusing on. None of them were saying "I love what I do, I just wish this one thing would change." Maybe that message was hidden between the lines. But all I kept reading was "There are too many rude, inconsiderate, ungrateful readers and I don't think they deserve to read what I produce". And if you really feel that you aren't being appreciated and you no longer like what you do, I think the only way you'll be happy is if you quit. Because at the end of the day, you aren't going to be able to force every reader to appreciate what you do, let alone contribute to scanlating.
» cmertb on October 21st, 2013, 6:26pm
» nakie08 on October 21st, 2013, 6:29pm
» KaoriNite on October 21st, 2013, 9:50pm
Yes, I can only make suggestions based on what people write. I'm not a mind-reader.
My opinions may mean less because I'm not a scanlator, but everyone is able to have opinion. Especially since the topic of this forum is based from the opinion of the manga READER (with the exception of the option "People who ask: "When will the next chapter be released?")
Sorry, was I forcing my opinions on someone? In a debate, you present your side and hope to convince the other party, but debating is not "forcing". Afterall, I can't make you, or really anyone else for that matter, do anything they don't want to.
And as I said in the statement before, I was making those suggestions because there are so many people only complaining about how much they hate being unappreciated for their scans, without mentioning that they find anything enjoyable in what they do.
Isn't the basis of these forums to talk about your ideas with other people. I don't know where in my previous posts I ever suggested that everyone is like me or should be like me. And am I only supposed to to make suggestions that I know everyone else will agree with?
Edit: and at this point I'm just going to ban myself from talking with you since our conversations aren't doing anything productive. sorry for taking up so much space in the topic with this B.S.
» nakie08 on October 22nd, 2013, 12:13am
You confused every little thing I said. You even broke it up into sentences. Of course you'll miss the point that way. I felt like all I did here is explain my last post and had nothing to debate on. To be more clear I will explain what pissed me off so much so you get it okay? Scanlators work VERY hard jobs just to give the leechers something to read. Leechers take that for granted and just selfishly ask for more. But that I get since I TOO am a leecher of other scanteams work. I know the feeling of wanting more manga to read. What I HATE is after all those hard work, here you come telling scanlators to "quit whining or quit scanlating". I know that's not what you said exactly, but that is how I read it. That's a whole new level of ungratefulness.
As I said before, The next time you decide jump into an argument, weigh the gravity of what you are saying. To the mods, sorry for taking up so much space. I, too, am out of here.
» PROzess on October 22nd, 2013, 6:36am
(For the most time) I work on series I like myself, but even then, if tons of people come to you saying "MOAAAA", it gets annoying.
I don't want your thanks, I don't want your money, I just want to scanlate in peace and complaining disturbs that peace.
Thanks are always welcomed, but not getting any isn't something that makes me quit. Complains on the other hand are a major reason to quit.
» T1 on October 22nd, 2013, 7:10am
No the reason why everyone doesn't speak Japanese is that everyone don't got an interest in it. It would be like China...1,351 billion people speaking Chinese. Not because of ability, time and resources but cuz they need to do so. Otherwise they would have a big problem living in China.
I agree with "there's no need to translate for people if they complain" reason. Still explain this to me: If I stop because of one tard, what about the rest of the readers who love the title?
» KaoriNite on October 22nd, 2013, 7:32am
You can't compare the two. Learning your native language is completely different from learning a second language.
I'm surprised people are treating this as a completely novel idea. I've had manga that I'd been reading be dropped because the scanlators were so frustrated with ungrateful readers. Yes, they punished every one for what a few did.
» PROzess on October 22nd, 2013, 11:44am
The argument is: If you have time to complain or make excuses, use that time to study.
Period.
» KaoriNite on October 22nd, 2013, 6:56pm
Their argument is different from yours.
» cecropiamoth on October 20th, 2013, 2:48pm
This is really unrealistic. It's like telling someone who likes to watch soccer but can't find it on the tube in the USA to go start a team himself (or move to a soccer-playing country). People have jobs and families. They have to give those first priority. These days jobs are getting ever more demanding. There's very, very little time left for fun and personal interests. Someone who lives in this hectic work world and sets out to learn Japanese MIGHT learn it in, say, 5 years if he could stick with it that long, and didn't give up after falling asleep over the kanji in a few months.
Not to mention that most readers of manga (including me), just aren't interested enough in it to take on THAT big a job.
I think most viewers of manga are very often very grateful for a scanlation. I know I am! It's too bad there's not some convenient way, right there on the aggregation sites, to tell them how grateful we are. Maybe Botato could find a way to make that possible.
» sophie0 on October 20th, 2013, 3:11pm
edit: also, I managed to learn enough Japanese to be able to read manga in about a year. While working full time. It was a lot of work but it was worth it. (Which, again, is not to say everyone should do that, but, well, rather than complaining that no.group was scanlating the manga I wanted to read, I practiced kanji.)
» PROzess on October 21st, 2013, 4:12am
This is really unrealistic. It's like telling someone who likes to watch soccer but can't find it on the tube in the USA to go start a team himself (or move to a soccer-playing country). People have jobs and families. They ...
You cant compare learning a language with starting a soccer team-.-
You can perfectly study Japanese bit by bit on a regular basis. You don't need to invest 8hours a day. 1h or even 30min are fine, as long as you keep it up regularly.
I don't know what kind of harsh life you are living that doesnt even allow you to have one free hour in a week for studying japanese-.-
I know plenty of people that succeeded slowly but surely in their studies by dedicating 1-2 hours per week on it. So stop with the excuses.
If you don't want to learn it, it's a different matter, but then you aren't allowed to complain about scanlators, which ultimately is my point.
» T1 on October 22nd, 2013, 7:20am
You people are so lazy that you compare learning Japanese with making a "soccer" team that it's ridiculous. It doesn't come as a surprise though. When Chinese students go to USA to study they can't use their own names. Why? cuz you compare the act of being able to pronounce their names with making a "soccer" team so you just don't do it. Instead they are kinda forced to get themself an american name like Racheal or Stephen instead of Xiang or Dam. Well if you can't respect others by using their real names then it's no wonder that learning Japanese is hard when you compare everything with making a "soccer" team. THAT BIG A JOB, EH?!
Being grateful is fine but even if you can't do Japanese there's lots of stuff you can help them with. I'm quite sure you know that translating isn't the only job in a scanlation group. If you do then I'm sure you are nothing but a leecher.
» KaoriNite on October 22nd, 2013, 7:40am
You're getting a bit off topic, but in response to this I'm American and we have tons of foreigners. I've never been any where where they were forced to change their names, In most cases, people change their names on their own because they get tired of people struggling with the pronunciation. Americans themselves often have strange names (you thought Beyonce was a special case?). Most people will try to pronounce others' names as well as they can.
Also, the topic of learning Japanese came up because someone was saying that readers should learn Japanese and then they wouldn't have to complain about the quality and speed of scans. No one ever mentioned that they wouldn't be useful to a scanlation group because they can't read Japanese.
» aagcnet on October 20th, 2013, 3:46pm
its mostly because this other option: When a good series stops being scanlated because it's not popular
hehehe so we got a winner
» telepop on October 20th, 2013, 5:47pm
» Dionaea on October 22nd, 2013, 2:04am
» T1 on October 22nd, 2013, 7:22am
1) Having too many proofreaders ends up with people not doing enough and the bored proofreaders starts making problems instead of helping out.
2) Leechers want their next chapter and it can't come out too fast so groups jumps over the proofreading and let the QC'er do it who sux as proofreading or focus on the editing mistakes.
Sucks but true
» T1 on October 22nd, 2013, 7:27am
I hate shitty translation too...but that's what happens when there aren't being produced enough Japanese translators and you have to resort to chinese-english, viet-english, french-english translator...or google translate, lol. You can't really expect the old translators to continue until they die, you know...
Anime is popular cuz people watch TV and anime pops up on their TV. This in turn also focus on the manga or novel which the anime is based on and more people starts reading it. So it's only a plus if you want more people to know your favorite title. ^^
» nakie08 on October 21st, 2013, 1:02am
» Jet on October 21st, 2013, 11:52am
I like speed scanlations. Never cared about quality and never will. I got a firm belief, that real gems shall shine regardless. And there is way too much raw stuff, so the faster equals the better .
I don't really care about people making money off scanlations all that much. I'm just a leecher and I enjoy speedy and comfy reading. A couple of adblocked banners won't ever hurt^^.
And it doesn't matter to me what kind of reason there was for a group to stop scanlating. The title would most likely stay dead and that's all there is. Want to read it, but can't, well, that's life for you. Oh, and in like 99% of those cases, it means, that that manga shall seriously go downhill afterwards.
It's sorta lame, when a group has too many projects and releases are slow for the series you read, but look on the bright side - we might get to learn more series this way too.
Guess, I'll vote for "when multiple groups scanlate the same series". It's been nagging me forever. So much potential being lost. But who are we to complain? Looks like there are lots of ppl, who won't ever consider translating anything beside One piece, Noblesse or whatever, even if their releases are pretty much useless.
» Karuna on October 21st, 2013, 5:15pm
I'm not only a lecher I'm also a cleaner or a typesetter for some groups so I think it's okay if I complain a little.
The thing that angers me the most is when multiple groups scanlate the same series, it really get's me mad. There are sooo many super great series so why do you want do the same two times? At last they could do a join.
And I think lately it's happening more than before, in the genre I read at last.
Edit: I left one more thing that I don't like pretty much but it isn't in the list, I don't want to make mad anyone and everyone can do what they want but even so don't like it...
I don't like when there are many good groups of the same genre and then a lot of new groups start to pop-up because I know what that will lead to "When scanlation stops due to a Cease & Desist" and "When a good series stops being scanlated because the group closed". I think so, because even if there are a lot of groups the staff translators/editors doesn't change so one group or another is left without staff .
And now I've really stopped complaining, even thought when I see people saying to make the releases quicker I think why don't you join if you have a little of time everyday, at least to be a typesetter, for me that doesn't take to much time. Because I'd like to have faster releases too you know?
But I'm not mad at the readers because in the groups I'm in they are pretty grateful and they almost always say thanks .
» mysstris on October 21st, 2013, 11:29pm
But you're right, it's happening more than before and I've been reading manga online for more than just a few years. I don't mind it. If one does a better job in terms of quality, I'll read that one. If they're kind of equal, I'll read both eventually. Plus it's helpful if one group suddenly goes inactive.
» T1 on October 22nd, 2013, 7:30am
Your readers must be nice ones...I wish every reader was like that. I had 200 downloads, 2 thanks and 6 mails asking for retranslation...I wish I had your readers who are grateful as when you release.
» Dionaea on October 22nd, 2013, 1:54am
Seriously though, it's so pointless.
» youtakun on October 22nd, 2013, 7:21am
How do I know if they are(/might be) good, you ask? I've seen them in magazines in JP.
I made a list a year ago, and now that I took another look at it, I see a handful have been picked up in the mean time. Remaining: http://www.mangaupdates.com/mylist.html?id=185425&list=u ser13
» Kewl0210 on October 22nd, 2013, 12:27pm
I generally think that as far as many groups doing the same manga goes, it's kind of silly, but some groups will translate/scanlate differently than others. Some are speed groups that do a quick, cheap job that aren't necessarily poor, and others do HQ versions with better quality sources. Also some just are crap and others try to do a better version. I do think it's a good idea to encourage people to work on other manga that's not being worked on than say, be the 5th group simultaneously doing the same one manga though, if it's already being done in good quality. Whining that something that's up to date with the latest in Japan isn't fast enough, just because other manga come out faster, is not.
It certainly is possible to self-teach yourself Japanese, because I did it. I didn't set out to become a manga translator, though. I started out just doing small things then eventually moved onto doing manga when I thought I could do it satisfactorily. It's better to start with something simple, maybe something with pretty simple grammar, and then move up as you learn more. It really just takes constant use of it, building on what you learned before and exposing yourself to new things (And repeating the old so you know it better). That said, you shouldn't whine about people not giving you your free grey-area legal thing fast enough or whatever. Or whine about tiny mistakes in huge projects. And it's certainly better to volunteer to help than whine all that time which a lot of people do. Though I wouldn't say you HAVE TO or anything.
The thing is, anonymity of the Internet makes it really easy for people to do that kind of armchair criticism. People see things from the perspective of their computer screens and usually don't take much effort in figuring out how it gets there. It is MUCH easier to criticize someone without really thinking than it is to consider how much work, time energy, they put in and what complying to their demands would entail to the person. And while sometimes criticism is legitimate, often people are just entitled brats about it. That sort of things upset scanlators. If a group's not doing basic proofreading or their translations are clearly full of meaning-related errors, or the cleans look through they were run through a washing machine, or they didn't even do basic cleaning they could learn in a tutorial in an hour, then it's worth criticizing. Whining that there's a small typo in a scanlation of 400+ lines that the entire team put together in less than a week to maintain an up-to-date weekly schedule, is not. Whining that a group is spending too much time on one project rather than the project they personally want the group to work on is not. There's a different in "wanting your scans to be up to a certain standard of quality" and "demanding everything be perfect while you are doing nothing to contribute or give back while the person does it for free". The thing is, most manga doesn't get scanlated and often if a group drops it, it doesn't get picked up. Or often the scans won't be of nearly as good quality. That goes for popular manga in the US/Japan as well as obscure ones.
Humans have a tendency to feel entitled to things they're just "used" to getting. If something is seen as a "we usually get this without having to wait" then if they have to wait, they feel like they've been denied something. People usually bring up the "it's a privilege not a right" thing here. Basically, when you get used to something always happening, you can start to think that it not happening is a denial of your rights, somehow. In cases like this, it really isn't. You've just been being treated special the whole time, other people have been going out of their way for YOU. It has to do, I think, with emotional empathy. The people that complain relate it to a company offering a product to them that they're purchasing, which is a completely different relationship, one where the source is getting money back which allows them to reasonably devote time to it and meet expectations in order to maintain a livelihood. They don't see the "human aspect" because it's not personalized TO THEM. Most people don't go about reading blogs scanlators write or anything, see who does what, learn about the scanlator's preferences, philosophy, likes and dislikes, creative choices, and all that. They just check a reader to see if something's there or not. It's really an immature, thoughtless response that I'd like to think most reasonable people are able to curb that impulse and realize this is something people do in their free time, for no money, that takes tons of time and they get really nothing in return for, doing it purely for love of the manga and wanting to spread that thing they love to other people. At most, it's good practice for being a professional translator or a writer, but it's not something you can put on a resume or get monetary compensation for. When you have free time outside of work/school/training/sleep/other important parts of life, then it's reasonable to do. If people demand that they spend more of their time on something, they don't consider that maybe the person would like to, but can't do it without sacrificing one of those important things. Like I end up having little sleep a lot of the time just to keep up with weekly schedules, often just so my own staff work on it because even they sometimes don't show up if my job's done late. I won't even go into the tons of problems between staff, but often if you have enthusiastic people who can perform every job except one, then the project won't get done. It takes every step being done for it to be done. It can often take more than hard work, but also compliance from other in order to get jobs done. I've got a good number of scanlations I've done over a year ago that aren't scanlated yet, and I don't have time to bug people or try to do it myself, or find a new group to do it with at the moment.
But basically, if people see something getting done for them that they don't have to do anything special for, they don't have any emotional empathy for the people and just see it as this cold-emotionless entity that it's okay to make demands for because that's what they're "supposed" to do. There's a diffusion of responsibility, because it's just a thing put openly on the internet that lots of people read. They don't feel like someone went out of their way for them specifically, so they don't OWE anyone anything, and they can therefore complain if something makes them mildly uncomfortable. That I think is what causes the problem. One group of people is doing tons of work for nothing out of passion and the spirit of sharing something they love, trying to make others happy for no personal gain, and the other group doesn't view that aspect and just continuously thinks the former group OWES them. That a group that takes a long time to do something is "just lazy" and bullshit like that. As someone mentioned, the relationship isn't even close to equal. And they don't make an effort to relate to the person or understand their situation at all, which is generally pretty immature and self-centered. Especially on the internet where everyone thinks it's okay to complain, blame, and shame everybody for whatever thing they feel entitled to have. Then they insult people that don't deliver. It's kind of a human heuristical response that only goes away with a more widespread understanding of how the process works. Which I encourage people to do, try to emphatically convey to these people what is going on, I mean. And maybe it will get people to stop being jerks about that sort of thing a little bit. Course, some people will just be spoiled brats anyhow.
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